Ok, so me and John were exchanging some PMs and got to conversing about the SH movie...
Then I brought up the idea of possibly creating a Fan Edit of the movie, whereby one might be able to alter/edit/cut scenes from the film in such a way that to watch it would be a somewhat more tolerable experience. This isn't anything new, you may have heard of an infamous Phantom Edit of the first Star Wars prequel which basically meticulously extracted Jar-Jar Binks completely from the entire film. Someone also did something similar to Batman & Robin in an attempt to remove the blatant silliness from it to make it more serious. I haven't seen either myself, but by all accounts they were quite successful.
So I started to think that the same could be done with the SH movie, even though you can never really fix the core problem(s) of the film. But I do think the damage could be minimized by attempting to take out all the, for lack of a better word, "retarded" parts.
Well, I've finally gotten around to this project I've had in my mind for the last year or so and I most definitely would like to share the results with you all! The other day I recorded the entire film and played around with it in a video editing program to create a really, really, really early and rough edit of my version of the SH movie.
Among the many changes you can expect:
- The majority, if not all of Sean Bean's character removed entirely - Certain lines of dialogue deemed unnecessary(->retarded) taken out - Little to none of the "peeling" visual FX for the dark world transitions remain - In the Grand Hotel, Rose doesn't jump accross beams ala Mario to get to Alessa - Pyramid Head's presence reduced significantly, almost removed entirely - Less blood & gore, much more left to the imagination - Certain music portions removed or replaced - Lame MTV-style end credit sequence..........gone - Much, much more!
One of the main complaints about the movie is that it's just way too long, at about 2 hours in it's current original theatrical form. Well, all the cuts in my very rough edit have amounted to a version of the film that is 95 minutes, not including the end credits.
Anyway, I'm still working on my rough edit to create a more refined cut. Once I have a version that I"m satisfied with, I'll upload and post it for download. Perhaps with your feedback, we can work to refine it even further to make it the best possible version of the SH movie as can be.
In the meantime, your thoughts/questions/comments/suggestions are all welcome.
Hmm... Interesting. Nice thought.Yeah, you can remove the retarded parts but the core problems [plot mainly] will remain. But it will probably be for the better.
I pretty much agree with the cuts you are making, except that I liked the transition/transformation into the Otherworld and the end credits (well not amazing but still ok). And what do you mean "recorded"? Is the quality/sound good? I guess the better the quality the better the final result. A DVD quality would be ok but an HD would be a beast.
Also, please tell me that you cut the scene with Sharon and the family meeting at the falls... Ahh, that part made me really angry and was soo retarded. I mean what an inspiration making this type of dialogue: - Honey, where are you? Oh, you are here. Oh, you are ok. Are you ok? - What? Did you just ask if I'm ok? Yeah, i'm ok. Everything's ok. - Is Sharon ok? - Yeas, she is ok. (It's ok.. Alright... It's alright... etc...) - Ok, then everything's quite ok or will be alright later. Let's go home. - Ok...
Oh, come on people... Are you serious? Didn't you feel a bit more retarded after reading it?
PieceOfSheet666 wrote:I pretty much agree with the cuts you are making, except that I liked the transition/transformation into the Otherworld and the end credits (well not amazing but still ok).
I think that the very first transition to the Otherworld, when Rose first gets to the town and descends the stairs ending up in the dark side..................is perfect. No visual FX, just the perfectly low-key and subtle effect that's necessary and so I wanted to carry that consistency with the other transition scenes that occur throughout the course of the film. It's a close match as to how the transitions happen in SH1, and that's my goal which is to try and change the film to be as much more like the first game as is possible.
I actually may have to leave them in though, seems I'm having a bit of difficulty taking them all out without it being a blatant obvious cut(and for the rest of the editing in general).
PieceOfSheet666 wrote:And what do you mean "recorded"? Is the quality/sound good? I guess the better the quality the better the final result. A DVD quality would be ok but an HD would be a beast.
I merely captured the whole film(from my DVD copy) in VCD quality for this first, rough edited version. Then, if you fine folks could take a gander at it and register some good feedback as to what works or how it could be improved, we could work on nailing down a better version in DVD quality. I'd like to do HD but I just don't have the hardware or software capabilities to do that at the moment, nor a Blu-ray copy of the movie as I don't have a Blu-ray player anyway. Only if this attempt at an improved, edited version of the film catches on and proves to be a successful endeavor should I bother to make a better(screen-wise) quality version. I wanted to collaborate with John on this, not sure if he's interested though...
PieceOfSheet666 wrote:Also, please tell me that you cut the scene with Sharon and the family meeting at the falls...
Oh yes, that's the other big change I neglected to mention...
Yes, that entire opening sequence, I'm happy to say, is no longer. For one, I find it to be terribly unnecessary, horribly acted on Jodelle Ferland's part, and as you've pointed out already some pretty atrocious dialogue. And two, it has the husband, and I'm trying to minimize his presence as much as possible. Still debating as to whether I should take him out completely, for now I could just leave him in at the beginning(researching the town talking to Rose on the phone), and at the very end, both times he's at the home and would kind of serve as bookends to the film. All the stuff in the middle, with him and Officer Gucci in the so-called "real world", has been excised. If I take him out completely, that means any and all references to him, the phone calls from Rose, any trace would have to be removed as well of course. It would be like he never existed.
In my version, very simple - right after the Tri-Star and Davis Films logos, the movie just opens right up from the title logo and continues on from there.
Amazing, if that was the ONLY change made, if you just take out the opening sequence and leave the rest of the film intact as is...................it's already a better film. To instead have the movie open with Sharon and Rose under the tree about to embark on their journey into Silent Hill works SO much BETTER as an introduction to these characters, you can't even believe.
Yeah, I guess you can work on the HD quality later. But, still, why don't make it in HD in the first place rather than make it 2 times? (In DVD and then enhance/remake it). The fist could be a test run to see how it turns out and you said you don't have the necessary equipment but just an idea.
And skipping the first scene and going directly to the tree is a good idea. And the start-finish appearance of Christopher's scenes is a good idea, 'cause you won't have extra work removing all the scenes he's mentioned in. Still, I too think that if it was possible to make it like he never existed it would be even better.
And yeah the end credits are not needed for such a version and will serve to cut the duration of the movie more.
PieceOfSheet666 wrote:Yeah, I guess you can work on the HD quality later. But, still, why don't make it in HD in the first place rather than make it 2 times? (In DVD and then enhance/remake it). The fist could be a test run to see how it turns out and you said you don't have the necessary equipment but just an idea.
Right, I would like to have done it in DVD-quality first. But there's also the issue of having to upload it, which would probably end up being about 4 gigs in size. That would take an insurmountable amount of time for me. I mean, just a 10min DVD-quality video clip takes me a good 3 - 4 hours!
My internet is pretty spotty as well, so I can't really upload anything too big for too long at a time without the connection breaking up.
HD is out of the question for me ATM. I just think that it would be better doing a smaller, low-res VCD version for now, not to mention more feasible to be able to upload as a whole, single video file. I'll do that for subsequent work-in-progress versions as well.
Once there's one that we can all agree on and are happy with, I'll then focus on making a nicer, DVD-quality version of it.
The Fever wrote:I am never one to enforce IP laws, but how could this safely be shared/redistributed? Viewing party at Silent Evil's house?
You bring up a good point though. Guess I hadn't really thought much of it, what with all the stuff being bandied about on Torrents and such. I think there's even been entire movies, like Jacob's Ladder, uploaded to YouTube in several parts too!
There IS, of course, a strict policy on many a forum against posting links to material of this sort, and Im sure John has no doubt enforced the same rules here. But it wouldn't even be the same movie, what with all the alterations I'm making, so I'm not sure it could fall under that kind of legal scrutiny. Hmm, makes me wonder how the fan-edits of those other movies I had mentioned were distributed...
As I said, I'll work on getting a rough VCD-quality version first. I'll get it uploaded and then worry about how to try and make it available for download thereafter.
The Fever wrote:I am never one to enforce IP laws, but how could this safely be shared/redistributed? Viewing party at Silent Evil's house?
Yeah, that is a problem... But noone has to know about it. Plus, since it's Silent Evil making it they will think twice before taking any action.
Seriously now, do the same rules/laws apply or apply in their full extent if the product is cut? Hm... I mean many people upload scenes and all this copyrighted stuff on YouTube but nothing really happens. Hell, there are even some posting full movies cut in 10-minute videos... [edit: just the same thing 2 seconds after Silent Evil made his post xD] I don't know - guess we'll have to look into it. And there will be no profit whatsoever. It's for a good cause.
Sorry Jason, I've been terribly late to this party. I see you've already made a thorough list of edits that would be done to the movie for your project and every alteration you mentioned I support fully.
As for sharing this movie when all is said and done: Yep, it wouldn't be allowed to be posted here--gotta stay on the good side with our friends over at Konami. But that'll be a different story which we can concern ourselves over later on.
Now, I've actually been keeping myself busy with two projects: One being the proto disc twisted has and the other a secret (for now...). With that said, I won't be able to really help with this for the next 2-3 weeks, sorry. However, I am very interested in helping with this.
I have a HD capture card in my PC although I think it was made to prevent any copy-protected discs from being recorded. The other problem is even if I could find a way around that capturing a 2+ hour video in its native resolution with a loseless, uncompressed setting would probably be in the tens or hundreds of gigabytes in size... no joking!
I noticed you haven't been on the instant messenger in a while but whenever I catch you I'm down for talking more about this and also having your feedback on my own little secret project.
Ratiocinator wrote:Sorry Jason, I've been terribly late to this party. I see you've already made a thorough list of edits that would be done to the movie for your project and every alteration you mentioned I support fully.
Thanks. There's also a LOT of little things I've changed or taken out too, I've only mentioned above some of the more notable or significant ones thus far. The rest are too many to name really, and not very specific either but hopefully they make a difference on the whole.
Ratiocinator wrote:As for sharing this movie when all is said and done: Yep, it wouldn't be allowed to be posted here--gotta stay on the good side with our friends over at Konami.
I'm sure when the time comes we'll figure something out.
Ratiocinator wrote:Now, I've actually been keeping myself busy with two projects: One being the proto disc twisted has and the other a secret (for now...). With that said, I won't be able to really help with this for the next 2-3 weeks, sorry. However, I am very interested in helping with this.
I'll no doubt be making many, many, many, MANY revisions and versions in that span of time and still be working well into this while you're busy with your projects. So once you're able to I'd definitely like to get your input on this.
Your video and editing skills could surely help to smooth things over on the final product as well.
(Secret project eh? How positively tantalizing! )
Ratiocinator wrote:I have a HD capture card in my PC although I think it was made to prevent any copy-protected discs from being recorded. The other problem is even if I could find a way around that capturing a 2+ hour video in its native resolution with a loseless, uncompressed setting would probably be in the tens or hundreds of gigabytes in size... no joking!
No I believe ya.
Although I can't capture HD video or movies either, I've been recording HD TV and I have to say that stuff is a BEE-yatch to edit! I wouldn't even attempt to do anything of the sort with a movie of that length in HD, it would simply be impossible for me.
And it's not like I'm an expert at this, don't expect the final product as anything close to being professional quality stuff. I can tell you already after looking at some of the rough edits that there's considerable "jumpiness" in the transitions from one scene to another, much of it's NOT going to flow perfectly smoothly just because of the nature of what's being edited out.
Trust me, I don't think anyone would want this in HD.
Ratiocinator wrote:I noticed you haven't been on the instant messenger in a while but whenever I catch you I'm down for talking more about this and also having your feedback on my own little secret project.
Yeah, been kinda busy with the holidays to bother logging onto the 'ol IM. That will change soon enough to be sure!
And yes, as an AIM buddy you should definitely fill me in on your little enigmatic endeavor there!
Silent Evil wrote:- Lame MTV-style end credit sequence..........gone
Why? That part was probably more like Silent Hill than the film itself.
That part was the perfect capper to how UN-Silent Hill the whole thing truly was.
JpD wrote:Please tell me you took out the "SILENT HILLZ! SILENT HIIIIIIIIILLLLLLLZZ!" screaming part. That was probably the worst and most socially awkward scene I have ever seen.
Yes, PieceOfSheet666 posed that very same inquiry to which I replied that I had taken the original introduction out completely. It's absurd, unnecessary and Jodelle Ferland's acting in that scene is borderline atrocious(though the script doesn't help her much either). In fact, I made an effort to remove most of her dialogue at the beginning of the film that I found to be, as you say, awkward and uh.........less than stellar to say the least.
That's when she's Sharon, I'll admit she does a better job when she's playing Alessa, er Dark Alessa.............whoever that is. She seems to prefer being in the "evil kid" role.
So now I have the film opening up, after the titles, to Sharon and Rose under the tree during the day about to leave for their trip to the town and it works OH.................so much better.
I've just finished the first official cut of my fan edit. I should tell you that this first version represents the most minimal amount of cuts that i could make, so much of the stuff I mentioned before is still present in the film. But I've saved the project in a way that I can easily take out all those other scenes that I wanted to in a heartbeat.
I thought it best to just focus mainly on removing lines of dialogue, little bits here and there in a subtle way but nothing big except for that original pre-title intro scene and just see how it works for now.
To sum up this version...
- Original pre-title 'Sharon on a waterfall cliff' scene is gone - Rest of Christopher/Officer Gucci scenes remain intact - PH still in, only the shot of his molecules forming out of thin air on the church steps taken out - Rose is no longer a beam-jumping platformer in the hotel, just cuts to her finding Alessa and back with Cybil - The grey children's attack on Rose is more like the game, she appears to be doomed - Film ends and cuts straight to the end credits.......no more "hipster" music video - Lots of bad Jodelle Ferland dialogue removed - Cybil doesn't wig-out as much
There's more little things as I said, but that's just the tip of it. And as I mentioned previously, I'm no expert at this so my apologies if it comes across no better than a heavily edited-for-content "R" film shown on TV.
Well, enough talk about it rather it would be better to just watch it for yourselves. Now, if only I can find a place to upload the damn thing...
Silent Evil wrote:Now, if only I can find a place to upload the damn thing...
Many places... The problem is the legality of it. I don't know what applies to such a cut version. But even if you upload it, I don't think anything will happen whatsoever... Put a disclaimer, say it's a cut version... Duh. Dunno, I just can't see any problem that would come out of it. Suckage... There are millions of files being uploaded, in this case even the full movie and nothing happens really. I don't see why it would create such a problem... Other fan movies use the soundtracks, the movie is available for download if you want to, soundtracks on YT, movie scenes on YT, media files everywhere. Why should this be different? Plus it's cut and non-profitable and if someone wants to see the full movie they can go get it.
But even if you do upload it I don't know if you would be allowed to post the link here... You should work this out with Ratio or also even ask Konami if you don't want to do it like this. Aaaaah. Dunno...
The BAD - The video file of the rough '1st cut' of my movie edit was on my laptop HDD. It had been sitting on there waiting for me to find someplace to host it for download availability, which I have not been able to do successfully. Now, that video file seems to have been lost for good after said HDD went down this last February. I didn't have it backed up elsewhere, the only version of it that still exists is a very low-res copy that I imported onto my PSP. It's not even up to VCD quality, and no one wants to see how that looks...
The GOOD - I am working on yet another version of the edit to replace the one I've seemingly lost. This will actually be the 3RD time of mine cutting together a copy complete from scratch. Hey, 3rd time's a charm.........right?
Here's the best part - once I'm finished with this version, looks like I finally have some place reliable to host it for download consumption!
If somehow that fails too, worst comes to worst I'll look into just making it available as a torrent.