Discussion of PT and the canceled Silent Hills game.
 
 

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Post by devil hunter on Thu Sep 25, 2014 3:01 am

Otherworld wrote:Regardless of whether it has anything to do with Silent Hills, which we know it doesn't, doesn't mean that things that happen during the teaser are not symbolic. I feel like there was a lot of thought put into the teaser. After watching the video Jam6i posted IMO there is a lot more to P. T . then just a hallway loop.


I didn't say it's not symbolic. just that we can't know.
 
 
 
 
 
 

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Post by jam6i on Thu Sep 25, 2014 3:18 am

It's commonly believed by a lot of people (but with no evidence, mind you) that some lf the weird occurances in P.T. that don't seem to be the ghost Lisa trolling you are actually past/future/alternate versions of your character going through the loop...

So like, when you walk by the closed bathroom door, another you is inside the bathroom trying to get out...and when you are in the bathroom trying to get out, the other you is outside passing by the bathroom.

It's very bizarre.
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Post by Otherworld on Thu Sep 25, 2014 8:24 am

devil hunter wrote:
Otherworld wrote:Regardless of whether it has anything to do with Silent Hills, which we know it doesn't, doesn't mean that things that happen during the teaser are not symbolic. I feel like there was a lot of thought put into the teaser. After watching the video Jam6i posted IMO there is a lot more to P. T . then just a hallway loop.


I didn't say it's not symbolic. just that we can't know.


It seemed like you were questioning the fact that there was much symbolism at all and chalking most of it up to randomness ......

devil hunter wrote:The thing is, since P.T. won't have much to do with the actual game, it makes you wonder how much of it is relevant to the SHs and how much of it is symbolic.

For all we know, lights change because it's weird, that's it.


Like I posted earlier ..... we are still learning more and more about the teaser and it is quite evident that there was a lot of thought put into the teaser that translates into the symbolism that we are still discovering.

jam6i wrote:It's commonly believed by a lot of people (but with no evidence, mind you) that some lf the weird occurances in P.T. that don't seem to be the ghost Lisa trolling you are actually past/future/alternate versions of your character going through the loop...

So like, when you walk by the closed bathroom door, another you is inside the bathroom trying to get out...and when you are in the bathroom trying to get out, the other you is outside passing by the bathroom.

It's very bizarre.


I understand the "past/future/alternate versions of your character" thought pattern. But my only issue with this is that it is Lisa that invites you in, Lisa that closes the bathroom door and Lisa that tries to open it when you are trapped inside. This is all proven, as we know it is her that tries to open it because of the one high heel shoe she is wearing.

I don't know, I am more inclined to think that we end up dropped into an endless cycle that the protag is going through. But my guess is just as good as anyone else's ........
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Post by devil hunter on Thu Sep 25, 2014 8:39 am

Otherworld wrote:It seemed like you were questioning the fact that there was much symbolism at all and chalking most of it up to randomness ......

devil hunter wrote:The thing is, since P.T. won't have much to do with the actual game, it makes you wonder how much of it is relevant to the SHs and how much of it is symbolic.

For all we know, lights change because it's weird, that's it.


Like I posted earlier ..... we are still learning more and more about the teaser and it is quite evident that there was a lot of thought put into the teaser that translates into the symbolism that we are still discovering.


That doesn't mean I was claiming it's just randomness, when I wrote "It makes you wonder how much of it is relevant", that's precisely what I meant, we don't know what's symbolic and what's not.

I wasn't chalking it up to randomness, that's just one of the possibilities, doesn't mean everything is random.
 
 
 
 
 
 

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Post by Otherworld on Thu Sep 25, 2014 8:57 am

devil hunter wrote:
Otherworld wrote:It seemed like you were questioning the fact that there was much symbolism at all and chalking most of it up to randomness ......

devil hunter wrote:The thing is, since P.T. won't have much to do with the actual game, it makes you wonder how much of it is relevant to the SHs and how much of it is symbolic.

For all we know, lights change because it's weird, that's it.


Like I posted earlier ..... we are still learning more and more about the teaser and it is quite evident that there was a lot of thought put into the teaser that translates into the symbolism that we are still discovering.


That doesn't mean I was claiming it's just randomness, when I wrote "It makes you wonder how much of it is relevant", that's precisely what I meant, we don't know what's symbolic and what's not.

I wasn't chalking it up to randomness, that's just one of the possibilities, doesn't mean everything is random.


Well we know that none of it is relevant to Silent Hills .... so ..... ya .......

Agreed, randomness is one of the possibilities but since we keep discovering more and more it seems like there is much more purpose in the events taking place in the teaser. More so than we once thought anyway.
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Post by jam6i on Thu Sep 25, 2014 10:27 am

P.T. has one heck of a tightly woven narrative, and so far almost everything has been shown to be part of a single, extremely bizarre story. It's very odd for a relatively short teaser built for promotional purposes to have such an intricately layered narrative. Is it a book-ended tale not related to Silent Hills? Possibly. But I simply cannot bring myself to believe Kojima, Del Toro, and all those involved would create such a heavy piece of storytelling with such an astounding attention to internal narrative consistency that has nothing to do with the game it is promoting. It gets increasingly hard to write this off as "eh, it's just a teaser. Not related".

The beauty of P.T. (or, one of the beauties) is how random it appears to be. When the world first started playing and started getting seemingly random and unrelated single lines of dialogue in completely different languages when picking up picture pieces, it honestly felt randomized. Yet when everyone banded together, it turned out those seemingly randomized lines were parts of the same poem sliced up and divided across languages.

When that thing crashes from the balcony, it felt like simply a jumpscare, at first. But if you look up, you can see Lisa (or perhaps a secondary unnamed ghost) looking down at you. This ghost stares for a short time before backing up and leaving. So, what's with the crashing jumpscare? It was the ghost getting your attention. The ghost was communicating with you. It wasn't just a jumpscare.

The infinite red hallway felt completely random and non-sensical, at first. But once it was discovered the entire goal is to find the peephole, suddenly the infinite red hallway made sense. It wasn't random.

The list goes on to include everything in P.T. Not a single thing in P.T. has been random or seemingly pointless without purpose.

Except the multicolored flashlight projections. And that's my point. The game itself has proven that nothing is included because "hey vidya gaem", but because there was a specific reason to do so. Everything had a purpose, but it was all cloaked in a sheet of randomness, so it threw everyone...ahem...for a loop.

Those multicolored flashlight projections musthave a purpose or significance. There hasn't been a single thing so far that Kojima put in because "it looked weird". Kojima's style is not "put something in because it looks weird." His style is more like "put something in for a reason and also make it look weird".

Anyway, I've gotten to the point where I'm comfy in the belief P.T. is related to Silent Hills in a direct way. Kojimatoro have made it clear the events of P.T. are only a smaller part of a larger story. It's not over.

It's fine if one wants to believe there is no more to P.T. But knowing Kojima, there's probably more. Much more.
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Post by Otherworld on Thu Sep 25, 2014 11:03 am

Everything had a purpose, but it was all cloaked in a sheet of randomness, so it threw everyone...ahem...for a loop.


^ Great way to sum it up jam6i !
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Post by jam6i on Thu Sep 25, 2014 4:53 pm



Final part.
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Post by Pyramid_Heart on Thu Sep 25, 2014 8:45 pm

Who made Gordon Ramsay play the PT demo?
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Post by clips7 on Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:21 am

A small part of me has always felt that P.T. will be involved with actual game in some fashion...i can actually see P.T. being at the very first part of the game, then have the player actually begin the game when they finish that level (the part where the character walks outside). I still want the game in 3rd person, but that P.T. section was crafted so well, i wouldn't mind playing through that section again if it was connected to the main storyline in some fashion.

It's been mentioned already, but i'd be fine if the next SH game handled both 1st and 3rd person views in the manner that SH4 implemented it.
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Post by Otherworld on Fri Sep 26, 2014 9:31 am

^ I get the idea .... that in some way Project Morpheus will be involved with Silent Hills. I really do not know how I feel about that yet ......
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Post by jam6i on Fri Sep 26, 2014 12:27 pm

^If Kojima is claiming a release date no earlier than 2016...then you can be sure Morpheus is planned to be involved somehow. 2016 is far enough away that, by the time it rolls around, Morpheus should be a peripheral that a lot of gamers own. Not only that, but there should be, by that point, a decently sized library of Morpheus supported games.

P.T. looks so much like a Morpheus-intended experience. I just have to believe that it was partly on Kojima's mind when he was coming up with it.
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Post by Otherworld on Fri Sep 26, 2014 12:39 pm

jam6i wrote:^If Kojima is claiming a release date no earlier than 2016...then you can be sure Morpheus is planned to be involved somehow. 2016 is far enough away that, by the time it rolls around, Morpheus should be a peripheral that a lot of gamers own. Not only that, but there should be, by that point, a decently sized library of Morpheus supported games.

P.T. looks so much like a Morpheus-intended experience. I just have to believe that it was partly on Kojima's mind when he was coming up with it.


What I am hoping for, is that Morpheus is not absolutely necessary to play the game. I would much rather have it as a stand alone game that does not need cameras or mic's or virtual reality headsets to complete. Often times the use of such accessories especially if they are rather new, can dilute the experience.

Is one able to complete P.T. without a headset or any type of mic for that matter ?
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Post by jam6i on Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:41 pm

Some have claimed to reach the trailer without using a mic for anything. Just kinda randomly stumbling around until the fetus laughs. It seems that the mic may not be required, but still really helps to use it anyway.

And I personally wouldn't worry about Kojima making P.T. a Morpheus exclusive. The fact that you can play P.T. now without it shows it isn't necessary. With all the talk he's done about switches and controls, the most likely scenario would be an option to switch between classic mode and Morpheus mode.
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Post by Otherworld on Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:51 pm

You mean Silent Hills being a Morpheus exclusive right ? Cause that's what I meant ... :lol:
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Post by jam6i on Fri Sep 26, 2014 2:11 pm

Oh, yea, it still wouldn't make sense to make SHs a peripheral exclusive. That's a business killer. If you're making a AAA horror game, it wouldn't exactly be the wisest decision to make it only playable with an expensive peripheral.

It wasn't that long ago that we saw how the gaming community reacted to the Xbone coming with a required Kinect. Thing is, people are more likely to buy a product and enjoy it if it's an optional thing. If you force someone to use something, they'll go in with a bias of "why do I haveto do this?" that can automatically lessen the experience.

Sales of SHs would absolutely suffer if there was a footnote of

Buy Silent Hills today! Experience the return to horror for only $59.99!*



*requires the Morpheus headset for an additional $199.99
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Post by Otherworld on Fri Sep 26, 2014 2:17 pm

^ Exactly, I just think it's smarter to stay away from Morpheus and give this title its best chance at success.
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Post by Naroon on Sat Sep 27, 2014 5:29 pm

I don't think there's a high chance Morpheus will be involved. I also don't think it will take off that well, even by 2016. People will be making a big deal about it and of course devs will shill the hell out of it to get people to buy it, but I think it'll be a repeat of Kinect, PS Eye, PS Move, Wii, etc. All those were just fads that devs hyped up but then hardly supported. I think there's potential for a great experience, but I don't think it's safe to say it's a given that we'll see it in SHs.
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Post by Otherworld on Sat Sep 27, 2014 9:10 pm

NarooN wrote:I don't think there's a high chance Morpheus will be involved. I also don't think it will take off that well, even by 2016. People will be making a big deal about it and of course devs will shill the hell out of it to get people to buy it, but I think it'll be a repeat of Kinect, PS Eye, PS Move, Wii, etc. All those were just fads that devs hyped up but then hardly supported. I think there's potential for a great experience, but I don't think it's safe to say it's a given that we'll see it in SHs.


Yup, I also have an inkling that Morpheus will become gimmicky like the others you listed above. Just another reason why I hope Silent Hills stays far away from it.
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Post by jam6i on Sat Sep 27, 2014 10:16 pm

Whether or not VR ultimately is just a gimmick in gaming is another discussion...however the practical applications of a device that allows a person to experience the sensation of being fully immersed somewhere where they aren't are found on an almost infinitely long list.

I tried an Oculus headset awhile back (I had the chance to). Words can't describe it. That's why I don't try to. Because it's an experience that can't be described. Not at all.

And with gaming, there should always be an option to toggle between VR and classic modes, in case the player either does not want to go in VR or can't for a medical reason. I'm against VR-mandatory games.
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