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Naroon

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The Really Super Real Silent Hill Experience *Updated 01/05*

Post by Naroon on Tue Mar 25, 2014 10:33 pm

I don't think anyone really cares about them anymore. That stuff blew up in 2011 and it died in 2011, really. Everything after that was just discussing it whenever it came up.
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Trauma

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The Really Super Real Silent Hill Experience *Updated 01/05*

Post by Trauma on Fri May 30, 2014 1:41 am

Sorry it's been a while- work and volunteering have kept me pretty busy. Get ready for a long one. I will be making use of Thomas’ timeline for the duration of this post.

Why Your Parents Are Probably Boning It Right Now (aka Why The MDT is Officially True)

I’ll start this off by saying this- your parents are having sex right now… Ok, now that I’ve got your attention- there’s a theory called the Multiverse theory [1] that states there are potentially an infinite number of universes with an infinite number of scenarios occurring simultaneously.

The Multiple Dimension Theory

Similar to the Multiverse Theory, the Multiple Dimension Theory states that there are multiple layers of reality running concurrently throughout the area around Silent Hill. I submit that the series and the town’s metaphysical framework calls for nothing less than this.

The Single Dimension Theory

The Single Dimension Theory (SDT) has been around since at least 2004-2005. The theory states that the town of Silent Hill (in our world) is being warped by a nightmare vision made manifest and that this vision is subservient to “the power of the town” [2].

The Straw Man

A common straw man used to refute the MDT is that there are potentially infinite worlds the characters are traversing, which very few adherents of the MDT actually subscribe to. I’ll refer to any straw man versions of this theory as the SMMDT [Straw Man Multiple Dimension Theory].

The SDT In Action…
As previously stated, the Single Dimension Theory requires no auxiliary dimensions or universes to be present. This unfortunately leaves no room for explanation of the mechanics at play in the town, or so that appears… [2]
The theory has its genesis in some comments made by Harry over the course of the first game [3].

It’s being invaded by the Otherworld. By a world of someone’s nightmarish delusions come to life.


There are as many variations of the SDT as there are dimensions in the SMMDT. The most notable of this being that Silent Hill really is an abandoned town, and that it is being overtaken by a malevolent force.

…And Why It’s Horseshit

The SDT is supported by needlessly complex explanations, some that are even the MDT dressed up in different language.
There are several versions of the SDT. Some examples being;
1. The town is abandoned, periodically being taken over by a malevolent force. Due to the cult’s activities and rampant drug ring- the town’s economy was destroyed and everybody left.
2. The town is indeed populated, but the characters are surrounded by a ‘bubble’ of sorts. The bubble contains the nightmare world they perceive with everyone else oblivious to their presence.
3. The town is populated, however people are being actively removed from reality whenever an Otherworld shift occurs. (aka MDT-Lite).
4. The town is populated, but it alters people’s perceptions so that it only appears to be a foggy, abandoned town/hostile nightmare realm.

(1) is the most common. I will demonstrate why all 4 are incorrect.

Let’s take a look at the nature of the Otherworld itself.

  • It contains magical properties.
  • These magical properties allow it to reflect the psyche of those who enter. [4]
  • Alessa has much to do with how it functions now.
  • It is clearly not subject to the laws of objective reality.
  • It’s often displayed as a malevolent and hostile world.

I’ll start from the beginning- when Dahlia committed the immolation ritual in the basement of her own home [5]- it set off a chain of events.

The Koshiki Guidebook Complete Edition states [6]
Furthermore, due to the large-scale shift to the otherworld that occurred in the first game, the town has become a great catalyst for the manifestation of peoples' unconscious minds.


This “large scale shift” is not the power becoming malevolent, but rather more accessible- it is no longer a localized phenomenon in other words and has started actively summoning people. This is how the Otherworld calls Eddie, James and Angela.

Reportedly, there have been disappearances before the events of Silent Hill: Origins. Some of these have involved the cult kidnapping young girls, others are unexplained.

Silent Hill Koshiki Guidebook Complete Edition [7]
Among the mysterious disappearances that took place in town…


The disappearance of the Little Baroness being another prominent example [8].

A newspaper article from back then simply says "It most likely
sunk for some reason". Despite an extensive police search,
not a single fragment of the ship nor any of the 14 bodies of
passengers or crew has ever been recovered to this day.


There is no definitive proof that these people were pulled into [the Otherworld that we’re familiar with], yes- but the implications are there.

The Timeline
This is an issue that has caused troves of controversy. Whether the events can be attributed to a timeline or not.

Whether or not James and Mary visited Silent Hill before, or after the events of the first game we can only speculate, but there is evidence to suggest they visited after. A date we can give for the game is May 14th 1994 [9], the day after Mary had died. There is also substantial evidence to prove that the Lakeview Hotel burned down a year before the events of Silent Hill 2 [10]. The employee schedule indicates that it’s from “one year ago”- the most damning evidence yet that the town has not been abandoned. This is the hotel as James saw it 3 years ago.

We’re treated to a nice letter at the end of Brookhaven Hospital [11]

He who is not bold enough to be stared at from across
the abyss is not bold enough to stare into it himself.
The truth can only be learned by marching forward.


James traverses “the abyss” from the moment he leaves Brookhaven Hospital right to the end of the game- we are presented with the Hotel as it is when James and Mary stayed there, and then as it is currently. It’s still not the ‘real’ Lakeview Hotel, as the metaphysical makeup is incredibly distorted at this point- real hallways do not direct to doors that lead to themselves. The illusion is shattered.

…which leads me to the next section.

The Metaphysical Properties

Several times in the series we are treated to astounding feats of metaphysical acrobatics that, to put it simply- violate the laws of physics with a rod of razor wire.

We see hallways collapse in on themselves, doors leading into themselves, we travel hundreds of feet underground, and walk for hours in labyrinthine tunnels only to come out mere feet from where we started. We travel through buildings that have no business even being there, entire floors materialize out of nowhere and we literally travel back in time. And lastly, we traverse a psycho-reactive town that throws you headfirst into your own unconscious mind, encountering other people and having their experiences selectively overlap into ours.

With all this, it’s tempting to fall into the trap of saying “the power of the town did it”, and that it’s all one dimension acting erratically. But it would be fallacious to think so.

I submit however, that the Otherworld’s refusal to follow the internal logic of our world is further proof that it’s not even a part of it.

Nowhere is this more obvious than in Silent Hill 4. The entire plot literally revolves around traversing alternate worlds. This is most observable by looking out the window of Harry’s apartment. You’ll notice there’s no warped and bloody subway or apartment building. There is a reason for this- they are quite literally in other dimensions.

In Silent Hill 2, we encounter characters that were able to tap in to the power of the town to a small extent. These characters are Mary Sunderland and Joseph Barkin. When we watch the videotape in Room 312, Mary expresses an affinity for the special properties of the town. Obviously her thoughts and feelings are absorbed into the town’s metaphysical economy and manifested to form a being named Maria.

Joseph Barkin is another, though more mysterious example.

The doctor’s journal states [12]

The potential for this illness
exists in all people and, under
the right circumstances, any
man or woman would be driven,
like him, to "the other side."
The "other side" perhaps may
not be the best way to phrase it.
After all, there is no wall between
here and there. It lies on the
borders where reality and unreality
intersect. It is a place both close
and distant.

Some say it isn't even an illness.
I cannot agree with them. I'm a
doctor, not a philosopher or even
a psychiatrist.

But sometimes I have to ask
myself this question. It's true
that to us his imaginings are
nothing but the inventions of
a busy mind. But to him, there
simply is no other reality.
Furthermore he is happy there.

So why, I ask myself, why in the
name of healing him must we drag
him painfully into the world of our
own reality?


He’s clearly not in the Otherworld or the doctor would have no patient to examine. But his condition does say something about the fluidity of the town’s properties. A little known fact is that in an early version of the Silent Hill 2 script-Joseph Barkin, Jack Davis and Joshua Lewis were all intended to be auxiliary characters- doppelgangers for James, Eddie, and Angela respectively. These characters were cut from the finished product obviously and Barkin’s role was diminished to a passing mention.

We aren't given a date in the doctor’s journal, but if SDT is to be believed, why bring up a patient that stayed there over 10 years ago (the only way SDT could work) at all? He was obviously significant enough to warrant a mention- and it has a shockingly easy explanation. The journal was written fairly recently and he’s either still a patient there or has been discharged. Doctors wouldn't just leave around patient records willy nilly if the town was abandoned en masse. That would make absolutely no sense.

Odds and Ends/Q&A

And finally, we arrive at one last point. Between Silent Hill 2, and Silent Hill 3 we clearly see the infrastructure of Brookhaven Hospital change. From new hallways, to a brand new basement. Brookhaven was never exclusively a mental hospital- but the addition of another basement and a morgue tells us about various renovations and upgrades they underwent. Granted, this is in the [otherside] version of the hospital but it likely still reflects the [normalside] and real world versions. The morgue, renovated basement, and added B2 serve no psychic purpose- and therefore cannot be chalked up to “the power of the town’. Especially not with the addition of security cameras.

Q: What about Harry’s comments about the town being invaded by the Otherworld?
A: Harry is just blindly guessing. His assumptions mean nothing, as he has spent the entirety of the game getting dicked around by the crazed leader of some doomsday cult. The SDT may well have been accurate when there was just the first game in existence- but later installments rendered this impossible. In the Japanese version- the script calls for Harry to say “another world”, not “Otherworld”.

Q: If Harry’s assertions are worthless about the Otherworld, they’re worthless about the Gilespe fire. It’s only fair- Harry wasn’t at the ritual.
A: This argument has been made before to refute Harry’s assertions about the nature of the Gilespe house fire. In his notebooks, he makes mention that Alessa was “burned by her mother…” [13]. This is to act as a recap for those who have not played the first game- it would not be included if we were not intended to draw that conclusion. See [5] for more information.

Q: If the town’s spiritual power can create monsters from nothing, then why can’t it remove people from reality?
A: Because we never see it happen, that’s why. A mass disappearance of an entire town would weigh on public consciousness like 911 or the Oklahoma Bombings. Furthermore, there is never any mention of it in the series save for the odd disappearance and the fate of the Little Baroness.

Q: What about Vincent’s speech referencing “the pleasures of ‘this world’”?
A: He’s speaking in religious terms. Philosophers like Nietzsche were often critical of religion and its life denying properties- denial of the flesh in favor of true world theories. This is along the same lines as what Vincent is saying- even going so far as to chastise Claudia for this in the motel scene. It’s made obvious that he’s playing Claudia and Heather to a lesser extent for his own ends. Just like Kaufmann playing Dahlia for HIS own ends.

Q: Yeah, but Vincent also says “I built this church with MY power. The power of money that you view with such scorn”. If we are in another dimension, how did he build the church?
A: There is likely more than 1 entrance to the church. I don’t think anyone is insisting that the church appears and disappears with the ebb and flow of the Otherworld transitions.

Conclusion

The MDT is the simplest explanation for the events in the game.

  • The fact that the schedule in the employee lounge of the Lakeview Hotel is dated a year before.
  • The fact that the infrastructure of the town updates between games.
  • The fact that the town can perform amazing feats of physics violation.
  • The fact that Mary and James Sunderland stayed in the Lakeview Hotel years after the events of Silent Hill 1.
  • The fact that recent patient records are left around in Brookhaven Hospital.
  • The fact that Brookhaven is now a fully functional hospital with a morgue, rather than a mental hospital equipped to handle regular patients in Silent Hill 3.
  • The fact that there are unexplained disappearances haunting the town’s history.
  • The fact that we have 1 game that specifically deals with the concept of alternate dimensions as a primary game mechanic.
  • The fact that we are presented with a psycho-reactive town that moulds itself to the unconscious minds of certain people.

…All leaves absolutely no room for a single dimension. The MDT works because it doesn’t call for the Otherworld to act with sentience and manifest in absurdly meticulous ways, overriding just enough reality that it can be as small as a few feet or as large as a few blocks, or require that everyone else besides the main character disappear from reality with no one at all noticing. MDT simply suggests that there is a means for some people to access a psycho-reactive realm that can manifest itself by way of human psychic energy. Nothing more, nothing less.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Footnotes;
[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiverse
[2] Robot Alien Dahlia; A mechanism used by theorists who's works rest on foundations of pudding when pressed for evidence (of which they have none). See also; "The power of the town", "Anything can happen", "Well it's MY opinion", "Facts, Shmacks. You can use facts to prove something that's even remotely true"...etc. Essentially the least compelling reason to belief anything, ever.
[3] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eeilpzA7VY "It's being invaded by the Otherworld..."
[4] http://silenthillchronicle.net/VIII.htm
[5] viewtopic.php?f=31&t=436222
[6] http://silenthillchronicle.net/VIII.htm
[7] Silent Hill Koshiki Guidebook Complete Edition
[8] http://www.silenthillmemories.net/sh2/memos_en.htm
Memo on the Little Baroness in Toluca Prison. Makes mention of ship not returning to port.
[9] In Joseph Schreiber’s journal entry dated May 8th, he writes, “It was four years ago that they discovered the body with ‘12/21’ carved into it.” This was Peter Wolls’ body.
[10] In the employee lounge room of Lakeview Hotel, a schedule is “dated one year ago".
[11] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8DbBsnE2eE
[12] http://www.silenthillmemories.net/sh2/memos_en.htm
[13] http://silenthill.wikia.com/wiki/Harry's_Notebook
Last edited by Trauma on Sat Oct 04, 2014 4:29 pm.
 
 
 
 
 
 

PEACETALKER

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The Really Super Real Silent Hill Experience *Updated 01/05*

Post by PEACETALKER on Fri May 30, 2014 3:14 am

Why do people need all the answers? Can't we fight our human urge to know everything because we're scared to be confused?

EDIT: for the record I disagree with pretty much every theory ever
From what I recall, had Alessa successfully spread the crest throughout the town, the God would've been obliterated, or warded off. Instead Harry stepped in post-God-birth and murderized the shit out of the God. - NarooN
 
 
 
 
 

Trauma

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Post by Trauma on Fri May 30, 2014 1:04 pm

No one is forcing you to read it. If I can help prevent rookie mistakes that completely disrupt discourse then don't worry about it.
 
 
 
 
 
 

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Post by PEACETALKER on Fri May 30, 2014 11:24 pm

I completely respect the fact that you compiled your thoughts in a very well and thought out matter. I was just sort of making a general statement about how I find that people are entirely too bogged down by the details.
From what I recall, had Alessa successfully spread the crest throughout the town, the God would've been obliterated, or warded off. Instead Harry stepped in post-God-birth and murderized the shit out of the God. - NarooN
 
 
 
 
 

Trauma

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Post by Trauma on Sat May 31, 2014 10:43 am

Fair enough then. I agree to an extent.
 
 
 
 
 
 

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The Really Super Real Silent Hill Experience *Updated 01/05*

Post by Otherworld on Mon Aug 17, 2015 1:10 pm

TRSHE 16a - Silent Hill Inspirations (Books & Motifs)



A Website they reference looks awfully familiar here ........
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The Really Super Real Silent Hill Experience *Updated 01/05*

Post by Princess Kenny on Mon Aug 17, 2015 2:06 pm

I don't know if anyone saw but as I follow fungo on twitter I see that he has become out spoken about the whole drama between him and TP and about how they "Hijacked" his idea and then he apologized to Tomm Hulett on twitter. I never cared abut ll that shit but it caught the attentiono f my eye.
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Xuchilbara

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Post by Xuchilbara on Mon Aug 17, 2015 2:17 pm

Pretty much Fungo is a lot nicer than the documentary shows. I can confirm this as a friend of his. Originally, and there's old posts to prove this, the doc was supposed to be a celebration of the series. Ross didn't like that and pressured for change. Fungo was hesitant, but went along with it. Later, Ross did a bunch of things to Fungo, not excluding trying to steal his girlfriend. Fungo has been pretty private about this but TP keeps launching a public campaign against him personally, he decided enough was enough. Now it's coming to light just all that went down.
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Otherworld

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Post by Otherworld on Tue Aug 18, 2015 8:55 am

Fungo strikes back ......

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Naroon

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Post by Naroon on Tue Aug 18, 2015 10:03 am

Never thought more drama would stir. But I've heard from a multitude of sources over the years that Ross is a huge dickbag.
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Otherworld

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Post by Otherworld on Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:20 am

Looks like it will be fun to watch this little back and forth .....
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Post by jam6i on Tue Aug 18, 2015 12:19 pm

From what I understand:

Toilet Paper released a "SH inspirations" video. The video suspiciously contains mostly just things that Fungo himself discussed in passing during the Guy Cihi SH2 let's play, in which Fungo discussed ideas for an upcoming "SH inspirations" project. Thus, it appeared like Fungo was stealing Toilet Paper's idea when Fungo released the teaser for his video.

Fungo called Toilet Paper out on this (I believe).

Toilet Paper then started making some extraordinary claims against Fungo.

Image

Ross claims (among other things) that HE is the one who taught Fungo most of what he knows about Silent Hill, with the bizarre addition that Fungo liked Origins and the first movie (which a search through Fungo's own posts on this forum proves the opposite).

Fungo made a post in response to these claims

Image

Basically Toilet Paper is now downplaying Fungo's role in TRSHE video series. Taking credit for hs work.

Fungo created a proof of evidence image found here (the image seems too large to put in the post so just go to the link, its an image)
http://fungoreview.com/content/proof.jpg
In it Fungo demonstrates the scripting was started in December of 2014 and he made mention of the project at the 5 minute mark of the Guy Cihi lp posted in February 2015. That's plenty of time for Toilet Paper to slap together their own version of the idea.

Fungo and Tomm Hulett have mostly kissed and made up. Fungo has apologized to Tomm for how mean-spirited the TRSHE was to him. Fungo says the video series was not originally meant to be so harsh towards certain individuals, and those vindictive changes were mostly a result of Rosseter's input.

Toilet Paper comes out of the scenario as just a team of jerks. Although I believe that most of that jerkishness come from just Rosseter. I get the feeling the other two current members don't share his elitist attitude. I wish the other two members would just pack up and move on like Fungo did.

(And of course Toilet Paper has always been shitty. The HD Collection video was getting massive dislikes so they attempted to counter that by telling people to dislike the video on purpose as a show of hatred for the HD Collection. I believe that is what happened there because really, if the video were well received people wouldn't want to dislike it).
Last edited by jam6i on Tue Aug 18, 2015 2:13 pm.
There was a SIGNATURE here. It's gone now.
 
 
 
 
 

Whitney

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Post by Whitney on Tue Aug 18, 2015 1:09 pm

Otherworld wrote:TRSHE 16a - Silent Hill Inspirations (Books & Motifs)

A Website they reference looks awfully familiar here ........


What site? SHC?
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Otherworld

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Post by Otherworld on Tue Aug 18, 2015 1:25 pm

Whitney wrote:
Otherworld wrote:TRSHE 16a - Silent Hill Inspirations (Books & Motifs)

A Website they reference looks awfully familiar here ........


What site? SHC?


This one .....

http://alchemillahospital.net/
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Post by Whitney on Tue Aug 18, 2015 2:14 pm

Otherworld wrote:
Whitney wrote:
Otherworld wrote:TRSHE 16a - Silent Hill Inspirations (Books & Motifs)

A Website they reference looks awfully familiar here ........


What site? SHC?


This one .....

http://alchemillahospital.net/


Thanks I didn't want to search the video to find out.
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ERROR

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Post by ERROR on Tue Aug 18, 2015 2:34 pm

I wish these two would stop arguing about who learned what from whom. Everyone knows they both learned everything about SILENT HILL from me.
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. . . AND THAT'S THAT.
 
 
 
 
 

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Post by Disrupticon on Tue Aug 18, 2015 5:15 pm

This is the OP here. I just made a new account after having issues with my old one. I'd heard about what's going on between Ross and Fungo, and my only thoughts are...

They seriously just need to go outside. If I looked like those two I'd be doing whatever possible to curtail the stereotype, but whatever. I will say that Fungo's chilled out considerably, but christ this is tedious.
 
 
 
 
 
 

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Post by Xuchilbara on Tue Aug 18, 2015 5:24 pm

I watch with popcorn. (There's no emoticon for this.)
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Post by Otherworld on Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:50 am

Image


Image
 
 
 
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