Forum for all other Silent Hill-related discussion.
 
 

captain crowbar

Member

Posts: 2813

Joined: Sep 23, 2011

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by captain crowbar on Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:05 pm



I just can't buy into it. I wanted to clarify in a video because I've had needless arguments that never get anything done, because everyone's responses, even my own, are inevitably canned because this subject has been talked about since day one. Maybe my words will let people know that I'm not angry about this, but rather, passionate.

I want to state clearly right here and now: This is my opinion. I don't really have a problem with anyone wanting to believe that there are multiple dimensions in SH. The only real problem I have is with the Silent Wiki stating definitively:
"Silent Hill is set in a multiverse consisting of reality and two alternate dimensions whose form is based on the series' eponymous fictional American town. "

Maybe in the movie...but not in the Silent Hill games I've played. And to my knowledge I've played them all thus far (except for that super sweet looking arcade shooter).

Like I said, I still love you, even if you get angry. Please discuss this subject rationally amongst yourselves.



I made an additional video to help clarify things a bit.
Last edited by captain crowbar on Mon Nov 07, 2011 5:20 pm.
---
 
 
 
 
 

Xuchilbara

Moderator

User avatar

The Red God

Posts: 8734

Joined: Feb 21, 2006

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by Xuchilbara on Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:17 pm

The series and the creator's statements do not allow for anything less than an alternative world and reality, connected to our own. Its one of the reasons that fictional works such as Alice In Wonderland were used.
WHY NOT ZOIDBERG? (V)(;,,,;)(V)
 
 
 
 
 

captain crowbar

Member

Posts: 2813

Joined: Sep 23, 2011

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by captain crowbar on Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:20 pm

Xuchilbara wrote:The series and the creator's statements do not allow for anything less than an alternative world and reality, connected to our own. Its one of the reasons that fictional works such as Alice In Wonderland were used.


Explain, please.

Unless you mean that the game itself is, in effect, an alternate dimension to you or I's reality.
---
 
 
 
 
 

Xuchilbara

Moderator

User avatar

The Red God

Posts: 8734

Joined: Feb 21, 2006

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by Xuchilbara on Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:32 pm

Have you read Lost Memories? Have you seen the making of SH2 and 3? That's straight from the creator's mouths. Then you have the "other world" itself which implies another dimension. How else do you expect delusions to manifest?
WHY NOT ZOIDBERG? (V)(;,,,;)(V)
 
 
 
 
 

captain crowbar

Member

Posts: 2813

Joined: Sep 23, 2011

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by captain crowbar on Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:40 pm

Xuchilbara wrote:Have you read Lost Memories? Have you seen the making of SH2 and 3? That's straight from the creator's mouths. Then you have the "other world" itself which implies another dimension. How else do you expect delusions to manifest?


Lost Memories backs up the possibility that the real world is being taken over, not that the player is being transported into another world.

I believe that they never meant for people to think of it as a physical dimension, but rather an altered perseption of reality that all people have in their subconcious. That altered perseption then manifests itself from within us onto the real world like a layer of snow falling, and changes the landscape.

They never said that it was another dimension, just that it's not the world as we know it.
---
 
 
 
 
 

Floodclaw

Member

User avatar

Posts: 3583

Joined: Oct 13, 2006

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by Floodclaw on Fri Oct 14, 2011 11:05 pm

captain crowbar wrote:Lost Memories backs up the possibility that the real world is being taken over, not that the player is being transported into another world.

I believe that they never meant for people to think of it as a physical dimension, but rather an altered perseption of reality that all people have in their subconcious. That altered perseption then manifests itself from within us onto the real world like a layer of snow falling, and changes the landscape.

They never said that it was another dimension, just that it's not the world as we know it.


Oh, THAT'S what you were talking about. I certainly think that can be plausible, but I'll leave it to someone more versed in the intricacies of the story to prove the point either way, if it can even be proved.
 
 
 
 
 
 

Xuchilbara

Moderator

User avatar

The Red God

Posts: 8734

Joined: Feb 21, 2006

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by Xuchilbara on Fri Oct 14, 2011 11:05 pm

captain crowbar wrote:
Xuchilbara wrote:Have you read Lost Memories? Have you seen the making of SH2 and 3? That's straight from the creator's mouths. Then you have the "other world" itself which implies another dimension. How else do you expect delusions to manifest?


Lost Memories backs up the possibility that the real world is being taken over, not that the player is being transported into another world.


Wrong. The SH1 original script Harry called it "another world" not other world.
WHY NOT ZOIDBERG? (V)(;,,,;)(V)
 
 
 
 
 

TraceBASS

Member

User avatar

Once A Metal Man, Still Eating Stars

Posts: 1632

Joined: Feb 23, 2010

Location: Australia

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by TraceBASS on Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:23 am

Xuchilbara wrote:The SH1 original script Harry called it "another world" not other world.

Then, why does Harry say to Cybil on the boat:
Harry Mason, Silent Hill (1) wrote:It's being invaded by the Otherworld...by a world of someone's nightmarish delusions come to life.

Was the script changed, or is he saying two different things here?

And you make some good points in your video there, captain crowbar.
I don't get mad; I get even - which isn't normal, for someone as odd as me.

~ TraceBASS
 
 
 
 
 

Floodclaw

Member

User avatar

Posts: 3583

Joined: Oct 13, 2006

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by Floodclaw on Sat Oct 15, 2011 1:16 am

I try to think of it as there being different planes of the same world, rather than different worlds altogether, or one bleeding into another (except in the case of 3, where Heather clearly wasn't in the real world but also wasn't in the foggy world in the beginning).
 
 
 
 
 
 

Xuchilbara

Moderator

User avatar

The Red God

Posts: 8734

Joined: Feb 21, 2006

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by Xuchilbara on Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:47 am

Metal Man wrote:
Xuchilbara wrote:The SH1 original script Harry called it "another world" not other world.

Then, why does Harry say to Cybil on the boat:
Harry Mason, Silent Hill (1) wrote:It's being invaded by the Otherworld...by a world of someone's nightmarish delusions come to life.

Was the script changed, or is he saying two different things here?




Script change. If you play JP and are fluent in Japanese its there.
WHY NOT ZOIDBERG? (V)(;,,,;)(V)
 
 
 
 
 

Borg

Member

User avatar

Ghost

Posts: 6606

Joined: Sep 28, 2011

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by Borg on Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:53 am

I'll copy my post from other thread.

"Normal SH (our dimension), foggy SH (different dimension), otherworld (same dimension as foggy SH, but it's something like a new layer to that dimension). I always thought it was like that."

One more thing that confirms that it's another dimension.
Image

Plus all those Otheworlds in SH 4 for example. When he enters the bathroom hole he's going to different dimension. Even when he unlocks the door of the apartment Henry doesn't get out, he's in different dimension.

I think that another dimension thing is one of the stuff that SH movie done right btw.
 
 
 
 
 
 

what

Moderator

User avatar

From behind the veil

Posts: 2322

Joined: May 21, 2009

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by what on Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:08 am

Metal Man wrote:
Xuchilbara wrote:The SH1 original script Harry called it "another world" not other world.

Then, why does Harry say to Cybil on the boat:
Harry Mason, Silent Hill (1) wrote:It's being invaded by the Otherworld...by a world of someone's nightmarish delusions come to life.

Was the script changed, or is he saying two different things here?


We can't take Harry's, or any other character's, observations on this kind of thing as scientific evidence. Harry is only stating what he thinks is going on, based on what he can see. This does not mean his assumption is, in any way, accurate.

I tend to go with what is said in SILENT HILL KOSHIKI GUIDEBOOK KANZENBAN, which officially states that there is no certainty which is which, but that the concept of multiple dimensions is the most likely explanation.

A: Unknown! Whatever you feel to be frightening is the truth.

From the moment Harry wakes up, the town is already deserted. What specifically
happened is not made clear until the end-- the only thing that is certain is that this is not
an ordinary situation. While it is only natural to wonder about the welfare of the people
who originally lived in Silent Hill, one should be able to come up with a few explanations
after completing the game: everyone died, or what happens in the nightmare world has
no effect on reality, or it was all Harry's dream, etc. Of these, the most likely explanation
is that the events took place in the world of Alessa's nightmares.

Silent Hill is a town where nightmares become reality, so I want those who have played the
game to take the truth to be whatever each of them feels is the most frightening.

Q: Why is contact between the town and the outside world completely cut off?

A: Unknown! The line between dream and reality is indistinct.

The roads leading outside of town have all collapsed, as if there had been a severe
earthquake. If one does not understand what happened in this town, neither will one be able
to grasp the answer to this question. One thing that is certain is the fact that in Silent Hill,
the border between reality and unreality is indistinct. It may be that the town itself has moved
somewhere that is like another dimension, or it may be that this is all happening inside
someone's dream. Could it be that the real world awaits beyond the collapsed roads?
 
 
 
 
 
 

Xuchilbara

Moderator

User avatar

The Red God

Posts: 8734

Joined: Feb 21, 2006

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by Xuchilbara on Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:24 am

Harry's observances are correct. They were for SH3 too. "Why do I feel like she wants someone to help?"<---Doubting Dahlia.
WHY NOT ZOIDBERG? (V)(;,,,;)(V)
 
 
 
 
 

what

Moderator

User avatar

From behind the veil

Posts: 2322

Joined: May 21, 2009

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by what on Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:29 am

Dahlia's a pretty shady character, so to assume she's not playing him straight makes sense.

When you're starting to make assumptions about the makeup of metaphysical unreality, on the other hand...
 
 
 
 
 
 

Xuchilbara

Moderator

User avatar

The Red God

Posts: 8734

Joined: Feb 21, 2006

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by Xuchilbara on Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:40 am

what wrote:Dahlia's a pretty shady character, so to assume she's not playing him straight makes sense.

When you're starting to make assumptions about the makeup of metaphysical unreality, on the other hand...



He's the origin of the word "other world", (which is also used in supplementary works.) his assumptions proved to be true in 1 and 3. My point. The other characters never seem to display this so much. Also, if you recall, Harry's quote "its being invaded by the other world...." is used in Silent Hill 3 after Heather goes through the transition herself. (PS2 only.)
WHY NOT ZOIDBERG? (V)(;,,,;)(V)
 
 
 
 
 

what

Moderator

User avatar

From behind the veil

Posts: 2322

Joined: May 21, 2009

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by what on Sat Oct 15, 2011 6:08 am

I understand that, and I'm on the same side with you on the subject of this debate. I was really addressing how Harry's statement of "invasion by the other world" could be construed as evidence that the Otherworld manifests itself by overriding actual reality. Though, I suppose, I could have been more clear about that.

The reason that the idea of multiple dimensions makes the most sense is because the idea of reality being overwritten stops making sense once you wonder why these towns full of people (in the first and third games, maybe also in Homecoming) are, for the most part, completely unaffected by this subversion of reality. Where are they when all this is going on? Why are they all not drawn in? If they all disappear, why is this fact never mentioned? Mass disappearances of thousands of people would be worldwide headlines.

Really, the best reason to go with the multiple dimension idea is that it's simpler. None of the questions above apply.
 
 
 
 
 
 

clips7

Member

User avatar

MiNd...ExPaNsIoN...

Posts: 2340

Joined: Sep 28, 2011

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by clips7 on Sat Oct 15, 2011 9:08 am

I think i fall in line with it being multiple dimensions. SH itself is a supernatural force that taps into the said person's mental that then blurs the line between reality and and these otherwordly dimensions.

In homecoming i felt that newly developed section of the order was manipulating the town's power or using some type of black magic to influence SH's power in Shepherds Glenn...sort of how Walter from SH4 was using some sort of black magic to create the worlds he was able to in prt4....which resulted in everybody in the bldg (according to the 21 sacraments) being affected and drawn into Walter's madnesss.

The same thing happened in Homecoming, the whole town of Shepherd's Glenn was drawn into that town's madness by the Judge Holloway and that off-shoot of the cult manipulating the mystical force of SH to manifest itself there. I probably could've done a better job of describing the mult. dimensions theory, but i'm tryin' to leave work.... :mrgreen:
Knowledge, Wisdom and Understanding....these are the basic fundamentals of life....

If you can't amaze them with brilliance, baffle them with bulls**t...
 
 
 
 
 

Naroon

Member

User avatar

Pillman's got a gun!

Posts: 5326

Joined: Mar 29, 2011

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by Naroon on Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:36 pm

It's definitely multiple dimensions, and what said exactly what I was gonna say.

If it was really the "real world" being over-written, then how would these towns (Silent Hill, Shepard's Glen (perhaps), South Ashfield) contain residents whose lives are completely normal and unaffected by everything that happened once the protagonists' stories concluded? You never saw any newspaper articles or reports or anything of people talking about monsters roaming around and the overall geometry of the town being filled with bottomless pits and industrial architecture.

I mean even in SH4, if
REVEAL SPOILER
Eileen dies in Walter's otherworld thingamabob, then when Henry comes to in the real world, he hears on the radio that Eileen's physical body was transported to the hospital, but died of her injuries.
So how could that even be if it's all in the real world? Her body got chopped up into pieces, yet her body was intact but heavily injured in the real world? Exactly, multiple dimensions.
Image
 
 
 
 
 

Xuchilbara

Moderator

User avatar

The Red God

Posts: 8734

Joined: Feb 21, 2006

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by Xuchilbara on Sat Oct 15, 2011 7:13 pm

what wrote:I understand that, and I'm on the same side with you on the subject of this debate. I was really addressing how Harry's statement of "invasion by the other world" could be construed as evidence that the Otherworld manifests itself by overriding actual reality. Though, I suppose, I could have been more clear about that.

The reason that the idea of multiple dimensions makes the most sense is because the idea of reality being overwritten stops making sense once you wonder why these towns full of people (in the first and third games, maybe also in Homecoming) are, for the most part, completely unaffected by this subversion of reality. Where are they when all this is going on? Why are they all not drawn in? If they all disappear, why is this fact never mentioned? Mass disappearances of thousands of people would be worldwide headlines.

Really, the best reason to go with the multiple dimension idea is that it's simpler. None of the questions above apply.


I think you can explain the "overriding" part as layers of reality. The more layers the further you go from the original. Thus, it becomes its own world, but it still does the ripple effect to it's core.
WHY NOT ZOIDBERG? (V)(;,,,;)(V)
 
 
 
 
 

captain crowbar

Member

Posts: 2813

Joined: Sep 23, 2011

Location: United States

I thought about the Multiple Dimension Theory.

Post by captain crowbar on Sun Oct 16, 2011 4:24 pm

I think people are forgetting that every single "other world" is essentially a dream/nightmare. Which is what I was talking about in the video. Is a nightmare another dimension? To the person involved, perhaps. But when it comes out of their head and into physical reality...

Why do the characters have to be in another dimension for this to occur? Hasn't Silent Hill's power been proven to be strong enough to just flat out do this in the real world?

If anything, the only "other dimension" that is present ever in the series is in a dream.

And as far as the random holes, cliffs, and unexplained things are concerned, the spiritual energies are the easiest explanations as well. Silent Hill's mad voodoo hoodoo can do anything it wants.

Why don't people talk about the strange events? Well, how many people usually make it out of Silent Hill at the end of the games? Like, 2 or 3 usually. And they either keep things a secret or, like Douglas, try to tell people about it and get called a total spaz.

And on that note, if the spiritual power is always there, and they're in an alternate dimension from the very beginning of each game, then how are they able to just walk out of town at the end of the games?

I'm not stating facts, I know...but the best way to discuss Silent Hill is with a question party.
---
 
 
 
Next


Return to Silent Hill General Discussion



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests