Silenthill4life

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by Silenthill4life on Tue Jan 13, 2015 3:07 am

Do you think the game would have been better if they made the game canonical within the same SH universe as where SH1 and SH3 took place.

I feel like instead of it being a re-imagining or canonical in alternate universe, they should have had the actual Heather from SH3 undergo therapy after the events of SH3 to recover from losing her dad at the hands of Claudia (rather than a car crash) and her difficult upbringing (having to relocate from the order)

They could have still had her falsifying her past in a bid to compensate for the aforementioned events (her difficult childhood with having to relocate after her attempted abduction by the order and losing her dad by Claudia). Also we could have played as the spirit, conscience or memory of Harry Mason, whom was being projected by Heather using her psychic energy.
The endings could also have been retained with the spirit/conscience of Harry reconciling with Heather, at the lighthouse where her therapy sessions are being held.

The only rectifications needed would be the role of Kaufmann, Lisa and Dahlia. Kaufmann shouldn't be the therapist as he would be dead following the events of SH3 (unless Heather is talking to a mental projection of her/Alessa's 'ideal' Kaufmann, a kind/caring doctor). Same too for Lisa.

As for Dahlia, perhaps Heather could have intentionally re-imagined her as the sweet, affectionate Mother Alessa desperately wanted....or left her out completely and have the game solely between her and her coming to accept her dad's death at the hands of Claudia (rather than a car crash).
Also the ending where she leaves the lighthouse and reunites with Dahlia could have been replaced with her meeting up with Douglas instead.

Basically I feel like they could have continued off with Heather's story after SH3 using the same gameplay and same concept rather than leave it as a re-imaging with it being canonical in alternate universe. Heather could have been troubled too, but not from growing up without Harry, but rather finding it difficult to integrate after the events of SH3.

So...what do you guys think (and my apologies if this sounds absurd/stupid to you but I would still love to hear your opinions so thanks! :P)
 
 
 
 
 

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by PinentidHead on Wed Jan 14, 2015 3:06 pm

Shattered Memories is considered a main series game, and that was being expected at that time, so this explain to me a bit of disappointing with the game. I think Konami had serious difficulties dealing with the franchise created by three canonical games. I'm with the opinion that SHSM should be a spin-off, and a parallel canonical game could be made. In other words, there is no problem SHSM exists along with a real main series, there is space for both. In fact, release The Room as main series game was already a mistake.
 
 
 
 
 
 

Silenthill4life

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by Silenthill4life on Wed Jan 14, 2015 10:08 pm

PinentidHead wrote:In fact, release The Room as main series game was already a mistake.


I feel like you just punched me in the gut :cry:
 
 
 
 
 

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by Pyramid_Heart on Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:22 am

Everything is fine as it is. The only problem with Shattered Memories is that there's no Kinect or Playstation Move port.
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Silenthill4life

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by Silenthill4life on Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:37 am

Pyramid_Heart wrote:Everything is fine as it is. The only problem with Shattered Memories is that there's no Kinect or Playstation Move port.


Hey thanks for answering!
 
 
 
 
 

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by PinentidHead on Thu Jan 15, 2015 7:51 am

Silenthill4life wrote:
PinentidHead wrote:In fact, release The Room as main series game was already a mistake.


I feel like you just punched me in the gut :cry:


That's good, you're beginning to feel the emotions of this otherworld! But I deserve an explanation. We had some discussions about SHSM and I answer in a thread if it could be actually a main series game, and somebody mention SH4 too. But I never had the intention of consider both as a "B" series game. I think The Room has a great horror story that will fit better in a spin off project, just like Shattered Memories. I think Konami wish to surprise the fans, but what happens in many cases is that fans got frustrated because there is no guns to fight back, they feel lost in the story, etc.. I read people saying that even in Wii they don't liked the game - Konami couldn't break this paradigm too. But in my opinion, Shattered Memories is a good game, a great new experience, I like it a lot. They just didn't deal right with their own creation.
 
 
 
 
 
 

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by Oohfakanorus on Thu Jan 15, 2015 7:51 am

What they should have done with Shattered Memories?


Made some great unlockables. Not for combat, but "X-Ray Glasses" to see through walls and clothes and flesh, "Hover Boots" and the like. It's a great story and experience, but they should have spent time on giving more incentives for replays, given that through the game there were details and designs to explore and look at. (The detail of the classrooms for an example)
Maybe it was all down to memory restrictions of the PS2?
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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by clips7 on Thu Jan 15, 2015 7:52 am

Pyramid_Heart wrote:Everything is fine as it is. The only problem with Shattered Memories is that there's no Kinect or Playstation Move port.



And that is a GOOD thing.....:coffee:
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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by Otherworld on Thu Jan 15, 2015 11:31 am

clips7 wrote:And that is a GOOD thing.....:coffee:


^Yup .... :lol:

IMO, they should have stayed away from the "gimmicky" Wii console in the first place.

I mean why limit where this game can go?

It should be a lesson. Stay away from gimmicks like .....

The powerglove:

Image

Wii remotes:

Image


Move:

Image

Kinect

Image

And dare I say Project Morpheus.... Ya I said it Kojima !!!!!! :evil:

Image
Last edited by Otherworld on Thu Jan 15, 2015 11:41 pm.
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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by what on Thu Jan 15, 2015 3:54 pm

Silenthill4life wrote:Do you think the game would have been better if they made the game canonical within the same SH universe as where SH1 and SH3 took place.

I feel like instead of it being a re-imagining or canonical in alternate universe, they should have had the actual Heather from SH3 undergo therapy after the events of SH3 to recover from losing her dad at the hands of Claudia (rather than a car crash) and her difficult upbringing (having to relocate from the order)

They could have still had her falsifying her past in a bid to compensate for the aforementioned events (her difficult childhood with having to relocate after her attempted abduction by the order and losing her dad by Claudia). Also we could have played as the spirit, conscience or memory of Harry Mason, whom was being projected by Heather using her psychic energy.
The endings could also have been retained with the spirit/conscience of Harry reconciling with Heather, at the lighthouse where her therapy sessions are being held.

The only rectifications needed would be the role of Kaufmann, Lisa and Dahlia. Kaufmann shouldn't be the therapist as he would be dead following the events of SH3 (unless Heather is talking to a mental projection of her/Alessa's 'ideal' Kaufmann, a kind/caring doctor). Same too for Lisa.

As for Dahlia, perhaps Heather could have intentionally re-imagined her as the sweet, affectionate Mother Alessa desperately wanted....or left her out completely and have the game solely between her and her coming to accept her dad's death at the hands of Claudia (rather than a car crash).
Also the ending where she leaves the lighthouse and reunites with Dahlia could have been replaced with her meeting up with Douglas instead.

Basically I feel like they could have continued off with Heather's story after SH3 using the same gameplay and same concept rather than leave it as a re-imaging with it being canonical in alternate universe. Heather could have been troubled too, but not from growing up without Harry, but rather finding it difficult to integrate after the events of SH3.

So...what do you guys think (and my apologies if this sounds absurd/stupid to you but I would still love to hear your opinions so thanks! :P)


Nah, I much preferred what they actually did with the story. I love the re-imagining. The more you look under the surface, the more brilliant it is. They did not just take the characters and do different things with them. In a lot of subtle and cool ways, they took the first game and re-told its story in such a way that it hardly resembles the first game's story. Yes, they could have used original characters to tell a similar story, but the combination of a compelling story plus the fun of finding all the distortions of the original story makes it a singularly unique story, both within the franchise and within games in general.

One of the reasons I love the game so much is precisely because they chose not to directly tie any of the original canon into it. The Harry/Heather storyline has been explored far past the point that I personally care.
 
 
 
 
 
 

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by PinentidHead on Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:05 pm

I agree with what. The problems I see in the game are more related to the package as all and the marketing. It's a short game in comparison with the possibilities. I still didn't plat Downpour, but it seams they used some elements of SM. If you look at Steam or deep in PSN/Live you'll find some similar indie games, a clear proof that Konami underestimated the potential of the game-mechanics.
 
 
 
 
 
 

Silenthill4life

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by Silenthill4life on Fri Jan 16, 2015 1:37 am

what wrote:
Silenthill4life wrote:Do you think the game would have been better if they made the game canonical within the same SH universe as where SH1 and SH3 took place.

I feel like instead of it being a re-imagining or canonical in alternate universe, they should have had the actual Heather from SH3 undergo therapy after the events of SH3 to recover from losing her dad at the hands of Claudia (rather than a car crash) and her difficult upbringing (having to relocate from the order)

They could have still had her falsifying her past in a bid to compensate for the aforementioned events (her difficult childhood with having to relocate after her attempted abduction by the order and losing her dad by Claudia). Also we could have played as the spirit, conscience or memory of Harry Mason, whom was being projected by Heather using her psychic energy.
The endings could also have been retained with the spirit/conscience of Harry reconciling with Heather, at the lighthouse where her therapy sessions are being held.

The only rectifications needed would be the role of Kaufmann, Lisa and Dahlia. Kaufmann shouldn't be the therapist as he would be dead following the events of SH3 (unless Heather is talking to a mental projection of her/Alessa's 'ideal' Kaufmann, a kind/caring doctor). Same too for Lisa.

As for Dahlia, perhaps Heather could have intentionally re-imagined her as the sweet, affectionate Mother Alessa desperately wanted....or left her out completely and have the game solely between her and her coming to accept her dad's death at the hands of Claudia (rather than a car crash).
Also the ending where she leaves the lighthouse and reunites with Dahlia could have been replaced with her meeting up with Douglas instead.

Basically I feel like they could have continued off with Heather's story after SH3 using the same gameplay and same concept rather than leave it as a re-imaging with it being canonical in alternate universe. Heather could have been troubled too, but not from growing up without Harry, but rather finding it difficult to integrate after the events of SH3.

So...what do you guys think (and my apologies if this sounds absurd/stupid to you but I would still love to hear your opinions so thanks! :P)


Nah, I much preferred what they actually did with the story. I love the re-imagining. The more you look under the surface, the more brilliant it is. They did not just take the characters and do different things with them. In a lot of subtle and cool ways, they took the first game and re-told its story in such a way that it hardly resembles the first game's story. Yes, they could have used original characters to tell a similar story, but the combination of a compelling story plus the fun of finding all the distortions of the original story makes it a singularly unique story, both within the franchise and within games in general.

One of the reasons I love the game so much is precisely because they chose not to directly tie any of the original canon into it. The Harry/Heather storyline has been explored far past the point that I personally care.


Hey thanks for your perspective!
 
 
 
 
 

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by CrazyCatLady on Sun Jan 18, 2015 12:43 pm

I have to agree with What. It's a different take on the events of SH. I've always been a fan of things psychological, and this one is probably the most psychological of the series. The end really messes with your head, and I love that.

It's the same reason why I preferred the second story of Life of Pi (the animals representing real people). It added a more psychological aspect to the story that made it very unique and original.
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Silenthill4life

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by Silenthill4life on Sun Jan 18, 2015 9:52 pm

Nutmeg wrote:I have to agree with What. It's a different take on the events of SH. I've always been a fan of things psychological, and this one is probably the most psychological of the series. The end really messes with your head, and I love that.

It's the same reason why I preferred the second story of Life of Pi (the animals representing real people). It added a more psychological aspect to the story that made it very unique and original.


That's cool
I just would have preferred that the story was canonical within the SH universe where the events of SH 1, 2, 3 etc took place
It still could have been a psychological game though.
 
 
 
 
 

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by ashatteredmemory on Wed Jan 21, 2015 10:12 am

To make it canonical, and your version too, makes the story way too intricate. It makes it too unbelievable too. It's okay to have twists, but spirits, brainwashing (or falseifying), ... it asks way too much of a story which could be simple. The story as is works and is believable, but because it's kept simple. The whole end sequence is beautiful and tearjerking since it built up to it, without too much other story-elements interfering. Add other elements (like the whole brainwashing thing) and it becomes unbelievable. It doesn't retain its strength because you are thinking or worrying too much about the other elements, since a whole lot of what you've done, seen or heard wasn't actually real.

To make it canonical, and your version too, makes the story way too intricate.
The story as is works, because it's still kept simple, instead of having to tie in with set canon. What you are suggesting makes the story unnecessary difficult to understand, especially for people who haven't played previous games.
And to add onto that, almost everything you've done, seen or heard as Harry ISN'T REAL, since a lot of SHSM features background which can't be true in the set canon. True, Harry himself isn't real, but he experiences elements of Cheryl's background which themselves are true in SHSM canon, but not in SH canon.
And from what I've learnt from storytelling is you can't make everything your protagonist goes through a lie for the audience. It can be a lie for the protagonist, but everything he has done, seen or heard at least needs to be real.

2 examples:
SPOILERS AHEAD FOR SHUTTER ISLAND AND LA CASA MUDA
REVEAL SPOILER
Shutter Island: Almost everything we see happening is happening in the mind of Teddy Daniels. The audience is as much fooled as the protagonist at the time of the reveal or end.
La Casa Muda: We're taken along a ride of suspense, but only to find out that everything we've seen isn't true. The protagonist wasn't doing everything we saw. She was actually doing something else entirely. She isn't fooled or anything.
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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by Meltdown on Wed Jan 21, 2015 8:26 pm

I quite liked what they did with it. The only thing I wasn't a fan of was the whole running from the creatures thing. I'm all for not having combat in a horror game, but it has to be done right, and I don't think it was in SM.
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Silenthill4life

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by Silenthill4life on Thu Jan 22, 2015 2:30 am

ashatteredmemory wrote:To make it canonical, and your version too, makes the story way too intricate. It makes it too unbelievable too. It's okay to have twists, but spirits, brainwashing (or falseifying), ... it asks way too much of a story which could be simple. The story as is works and is believable, but because it's kept simple. The whole end sequence is beautiful and tearjerking since it built up to it, without too much other story-elements interfering. Add other elements (like the whole brainwashing thing) and it becomes unbelievable. It doesn't retain its strength because you are thinking or worrying too much about the other elements, since a whole lot of what you've done, seen or heard wasn't actually real.

To make it canonical, and your version too, makes the story way too intricate.
The story as is works, because it's still kept simple, instead of having to tie in with set canon. What you are suggesting makes the story unnecessary difficult to understand, especially for people who haven't played previous games.
And to add onto that, almost everything you've done, seen or heard as Harry ISN'T REAL, since a lot of SHSM features background which can't be true in the set canon. True, Harry himself isn't real, but he experiences elements of Cheryl's background which themselves are true in SHSM canon, but not in SH canon.
And from what I've learnt from storytelling is you can't make everything your protagonist goes through a lie for the audience. It can be a lie for the protagonist, but everything he has done, seen or heard at least needs to be real.

2 examples:
SPOILERS AHEAD FOR SHUTTER ISLAND AND LA CASA MUDA
REVEAL SPOILER
Shutter Island: Almost everything we see happening is happening in the mind of Teddy Daniels. The audience is as much fooled as the protagonist at the time of the reveal or end.
La Casa Muda: We're taken along a ride of suspense, but only to find out that everything we've seen isn't true. The protagonist wasn't doing everything we saw. She was actually doing something else entirely. She isn't fooled or anything.


Hey thanks for your perspective
 
 
 
 
 

Silenthill4life

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What they should have done with Shattered Memories?

Post by Silenthill4life on Thu Jan 22, 2015 2:32 am

Meltdown wrote:I quite liked what they did with it. The only thing I wasn't a fan of was the whole running from the creatures thing. I'm all for not having combat in a horror game, but it has to be done right, and I don't think it was in SM.


I think the running away and not being able to fight the creatures was to make it more psychological. You felt more helpless as you were more vulnerable without a combat or defence system (other than hiding/running). I liked the hiding from the creatures though. That was fun and tense in the right way.
 
 
 


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