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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by SLDT on Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:38 pm

Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Be Viewed As A Stand-Alone Title

Introduction:

Silent Hill: Homecoming was a game that I personally enjoyed, and played through a number of times before I got tired of it. I got three of the five endings (Good, Bogeyman, and UFO) and didn't really see as many flaws with the game play mechanics or game's presentation as a lot of other people seem to have had. However, I will admit that this is probably for two reasons: 1) I think I really took the game at face value because its story seemed so irrelevant to the other games that my mind didn't even really try to connect it to the other titles and 2) the atmosphere and straightforward nature of the games narrative so sorely lacked the obscurity and thought-provocation of the other titles that I really just thought of it almost as a stand-alone title. Upon closer examination, I think that's almost the best way to look at it, and here's why.

I. Silent Hill: Homecoming Doesn't Add Anything to the Overall Narrative:

There's nothing we learn in Silent Hill: Homecoming that has anything to do with the town itself. While some proponents of the game (if any do in indeed exist) that Silent Hill: Homecoming fleshes out the nature of the cult or otherwise relates it to the theologies of people living in nearby communities, there was nothing the game presented that really seemed to fit anywhere. There were a few fairly obscure references to past Silent Hill characters, such as Deputy Wheeler's reference to the disappearance of Cybil Bennet and a newspaper article written by Douglas Cartland (both of which felt like crude fan-service), but nothing of any real intrinsic value is discussed about the town other than the events which led to the divergence of the Shepherd’s Glen sect from the main cult, which can really only be considered as being of any importance at all within the game’s self-contained storyline.

II. Everything About The Map Is Wrong – Very, Very Wrong:

So, I recently found myself leafing over a few of the maps from past Silent Hill games. I did this using primarily web resources, and hence found myself doing a little bit of research. During this research, I came across very artful fan-made version of the town map in its entirety. I really liked the way this map looked, and found that it well reflected the cohesiveness of the Silent Hill universe as it was presented in Silent Hills 0-4. Then I got to looking at the map for Silent Hill: Homecoming, and found myself scratching my head. Not only did the map of Shepherd’s Glen orient itself in a way that would make it very difficult to place about the shoreline of Toluca Lake (impossible if you consider the new map in Silent Hill: Downpour), but the map of Central Silent Hill itself was also changed in such a radical way that it difficult to even think of it as Central Silent Hill at all. The Silent Hill (Town) article on the Silent Hill wiki summarizes these changes as follows:

In the 24 years since Silent Hill, Central Silent Hill has undergone change. Sagan Street has been divided in half by buildings so that the western half is now a cul-de-sac. Koontz Street is also significantly shorter and ends perpendicular with Canyon Street. Acadia Road no longer exists. In place of the Cafe Sun is Toluca Lake Water and Power. Wein Street is completely absent along with the Artaud Theater, with Overlook Penitentiary standing in its place. The shoreline of Toluca Lake has significantly receded inland. A Boiler Room has replaced the Taco Shack.


A lot of these changes don’t even make sense. Why change the streets in such rudimentary ways? Why and how would you replace a single café with a power plant? Why would you replace a theater and an entire avenue with a prison in the central district of a resort town that already had a prison? And why would you replace a random restaurant with an even more random boiler room? All of these questions and more are never addressed.

III. The Game Isn’t Memorable And Lacks Real Substance:

Silent Hill: Homecoming has very little depth and virtually no symbolism. Surely you could bullshit a meaning for the monster designs, but there’s no real symbolism or meaning behind anything that appears in this game. Previous Silent Hill games have always had convincing reasons and explanations for why various things occur. Homecoming lacks this. Furthermore, while many previous titles have had numerous references and derivative source material, such as the original Silent Hill’s reference to various famous authors and Silent Hill 3’s inclusion of various plot elements from Jacob’s ladder and Session 9, Silent Hill: Homecoming lacks such inspiration. It doesn’t really pay very much attention to detail and doesn’t give you anything to talk about afterwards like any of the other games previously mentioned.

IV. The Atmosphere and Vibes Are Completely Different:

The monsters are obviously different and are much more aggressive and combat-oriented than the beasties presented in previous titles, but more significant than this discrepancy is the change in the town’s environment. We still have the small abandoned town permeated with supernatural fog, but it feels different somehow. It’s more open and less claustrophobic. You have more people around, and you don’t feel alone. It’s just not the fog world we used to know. And the Otherworld has been entirely changed from a blood-soaked version of your own personal hell physically incarnated to a generic, copy-pasted industrial wasteland. Not a very intuitive approach if you ask me.

Conclusion:

Given all of the artistic, geographic, and narrative discrepancies which exist between Silent Hill: Homecoming and the previous titles, this iteration of the series is very difficult to place in the series canon. Fortunately, given its lack of relevance to the previous titles, the game is also fairly easy to write off. Hence, I like to think of it as a separate, Silent Hill-esque adventure with a similar premise and storyline. If one insists on placing it in the cannon, then look no further than the Hospital ending; the entire story all took place in Alex’s head. That Alex… Quite a vivid imagination that guy’s got, huh?

Anyway, that’s my two-cents on the whole issue. I thank anyone who took the time to read, and henceforth open the door to discussion on this topic. Do you agree with me on this issue? If so, does your evidence match mine, or do you perhaps have other reasons to support your beliefs? If you think I’m wrong, what makes you think so? I look forward to hearing these points, as well as any other insights all of you might have on this particular issue.
 
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by what on Mon Mar 05, 2012 1:41 am

I'm not of the stripe which believes any of the games should be excised from canon for arbitrary reasons. Unless the events themselves contradict events which happen in other games (and, only then, if the events in question are actually significant), that's when a game's status as canon should be called into question. Shattered Memories is easy to exclude from the primary canon because it almost certainly cannot exist in the same universe (I don't pay heed to the wild theories which try to tie it to the first game's Bad ending because I respect Occam's Razor).

Homecoming doesn't have a significant impact on the overall meta-narrative, so retaining it has no significant negative impact. For the same reason, excluding it would not break my heart either (I have still not played it and I am still entirely ambivalent towards it), but there's a small and vocal group of fans who seem hell-bent on some weird purification of series canon by ejecting all the games they don't like, which I find rather pointless.
The above post is intended to be factual, unless it isn't.
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by devil hunter on Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:11 am

Not every SH game needs to have something about the town, plus inconsistencies are nothing new.

I don't really see why it shouldn't be canon.
 
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by captain crowbar on Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:58 pm

I actually think the opposite. It has a fine fit in canon because it doesn't change anything like Origins did (which I wish wasn't considered canon because it really mucked up a lot for me). It's a good side-story separated from the overall preferred narrative of 1 and 3. It just didn't have the best writing quality by any means.

As far as the map changes are concerned, someone once said something very profound which should apply: Silent Hill warps reality and creates entire worlds at will, right? So it's no real biggie when it makes a few buildings and roads appear in different spots from time to time. It can easily be chocked up to "Silent Hill changed it to fit the purpose of the story somehow".
"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. [laughs] Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched c-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhäuser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like [coughs] tears in rain. Time to die."
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by what on Mon Mar 05, 2012 10:33 pm

Origins does not change anything of any real significance, either.
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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by devil hunter on Tue Mar 06, 2012 1:27 am

captain crowbar wrote:
As far as the map changes are concerned, someone once said something very profound which should apply: Silent Hill warps reality and creates entire worlds at will, right? So it's no real biggie when it makes a few buildings and roads appear in different spots from time to time. It can easily be chocked up to "Silent Hill changed it to fit the purpose of the story somehow".


I don't think that's what happens. There are people living in the town. That's why MTD theory works, people would be questioning how the building appeared without anyone building it.
 
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by captain crowbar on Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:20 pm

devil hunter wrote:
captain crowbar wrote:
As far as the map changes are concerned, someone once said something very profound which should apply: Silent Hill warps reality and creates entire worlds at will, right? So it's no real biggie when it makes a few buildings and roads appear in different spots from time to time. It can easily be chocked up to "Silent Hill changed it to fit the purpose of the story somehow".


I don't think that's what happens. There are people living in the town. That's why MTD theory works, people would be questioning how the building appeared without anyone building it.


so...you're saying it's happening in the real world? Cuz I was saying that this is going on in another dimension, which is why the maps and stuff only matter in the game they're involved in...because they are only relevant to what the town's power wants them to be.

If people are living in the town and changing stuff, it's not happening in another dimension. See the conflict? Changes made by people in the real world =/= changes in otherworld

what wrote:Origins does not change anything of any real significance, either.


Pretty much everything to do with Alessa?
"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. [laughs] Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched c-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhäuser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like [coughs] tears in rain. Time to die."
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by what on Wed Mar 07, 2012 7:11 pm

Such as?
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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by captain crowbar on Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:06 pm

Alessa being a total bitch, and the idea that she wanted to live and birth the god, all things that were proven otherwise in silent hills 1 and 3.
"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. [laughs] Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched c-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhäuser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like [coughs] tears in rain. Time to die."
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by what on Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:15 pm

Funny. I find her quite in character considering her behavior in the first game. She showed absolutely no willingness to help or spare the lives of the good guys. All she cared about was achieving her goals.

And, I don't know where in Origins she expressed any desire to birth the god.
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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by devil hunter on Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:14 am

captain crowbar wrote:
devil hunter wrote:
captain crowbar wrote:
As far as the map changes are concerned, someone once said something very profound which should apply: Silent Hill warps reality and creates entire worlds at will, right? So it's no real biggie when it makes a few buildings and roads appear in different spots from time to time. It can easily be chocked up to "Silent Hill changed it to fit the purpose of the story somehow".


I don't think that's what happens. There are people living in the town. That's why MTD theory works, people would be questioning how the building appeared without anyone building it.


so...you're saying it's happening in the real world? Cuz I was saying that this is going on in another dimension, which is why the maps and stuff only matter in the game they're involved in...because they are only relevant to what the town's power wants them to be.

If people are living in the town and changing stuff, it's not happening in another dimension. See the conflict? Changes made by people in the real world =/= changes in otherworld


I misunderstood you, I thought you were talking about something else. I think that changes that are happening to the real SH affect the foggy one, some stuff seems up to date like cars etc. especially when we consider this is happening for quite some time.
 
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by hairymason on Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:15 am

I understand what you are saying about this game. Kinda lackluster and off center from the central story. However, haven't you had a Shitty day that made you question if you weren't just dreaming? That day is still part of your Canon, no matter how much you would like to forget. Same with this game, if you don't think its worth considering, why put so much consideration into talking about it?
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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by what on Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:05 am

That's a good way of putting it.

I don't much like the game, but that itself is no reason to excise it from the continuity of the series.
The above post is intended to be factual, unless it isn't.
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by captain crowbar on Thu Mar 08, 2012 4:54 pm

devil hunter wrote:I misunderstood you, I thought you were talking about something else. I think that changes that are happening to the real SH affect the foggy one, some stuff seems up to date like cars etc. especially when we consider this is happening for quite some time.


That's probably pretty true, yeah. I think Jeremy Blaustein said he thinks the Foggy World is pretty much the "real world", but that it like has some sort of "overlay" that makes it appear to be another dimension entirely. I think it works in a somewhat similar fashion as the movie, in that people in Fog World can't see or interact with people in the full-on real world and vice-versa, but that it's not in an entirely different dimension either.

It's one of those "too complicated to put into words" things, and people just label it it's own dimension...but I think it's more like an illusion brought on by the town, either optical or pseudo-physical...there are monsters, so the latter is probably true. But then was Eddie killing monsters or people? (I can't remember if we finalized that one so someone should help verify for me)

Basically how I see it is that it's the real world and the protagonists see it as fog world because Silent Hill is making them see it that way, but that it's real to them as a result. Like a transitional dimension in a way.
"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. [laughs] Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched c-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhäuser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like [coughs] tears in rain. Time to die."
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by what on Thu Mar 08, 2012 6:30 pm

So, what happens to people in the same place who don't see the fog world? Are they watching people in caused trances walking around and interacting with things that aren't there? What happens when they interact with something that can't possibly be in the real world, as happens frequently? How does it work when people are in places that have no real-world counterpart, such as the Catacombs or Nowhere?

It's not 'too complicated to put into words', it's 'too complicated to make sense'. It's the intellectual equivalent of a Rube Goldberg machine.
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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by captain crowbar on Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:46 pm

So you're saying Jeremy Blaustein is wrong? Because, as he put it, anything he says regarding Silent Hills 2-4 IS CANON, no questions asked.

Or do you not realize that what someone sees in Fog world isn't necessarily what's really there, or what everyone else sees, or what you would normally perceive as "normal"?

No, it's pretty easy to understand. Everyone sees what Silent Hill wants them to see, and its real to the individual. Ever see the Mothman Prophesies?

Everyone should watch that movie, it coincides with Silent Hill in so many ways it's crazy. Especially 2.
"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. [laughs] Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched c-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhäuser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like [coughs] tears in rain. Time to die."
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by what on Fri Mar 09, 2012 12:16 am

What, precisely, did Mr. Blaustein have to say on the matter? I am not familiar with his thoughts regarding this.

What I realize is that your take on things is ridiculously complicated because you have to account for how completely unrealistic events can take place for a person who is physically still in reality (an accounting which you neglected to make, by the way). Placing the games inside of a different dimension removes that issue, because once you step out of objective reality you almost never have to content with its limits. You have the freedom to break all the rules.

In almost all instances, the best theory is the simplest. That's why Multiple Dimension Theory is the most commonly accepted. This "reality itself is overwritten for people in absurdly selective and arbitrary ways" theory should have been discarded after about three minutes. It is an illogical mess, and it persists as the favorite theory of second-rate theorists who confuse complexity with depth.
The above post is intended to be factual, unless it isn't.
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by JaneTheNurse on Fri Mar 09, 2012 3:10 pm

I'll go through this piece by piece. It's my favorite game of the series (well, it's up there fighting with 2), so I simply must defend it.

1.) It doesn't add anything to the overall narrative
Yes, this is because it's a side story. It helps set the tone for the history of Silent Hill's relationship with other nearby towns. For anyone who wondered how other towns in the area deal with having a bunch of crazy devil-equivalent worshippers nearby... Well, this is how. It also shows the circumstances of leaving the cult behind. You can leave the main sect, but you can't escape completely.

2.) Everything about the map is wrong
I personally mark this one up to game design. People thought Origins was pretty tame as far as non-team games go, but it still added things to the map. So did 2. And 3. Every game has its own needs and changes to be made. I don't think Double Helix did it as gracefully as they could have, but they undoubtedly had to get the approval of Konami. For all its faults as a corporation, Konami still contains a lot of people who are dedicated to the games and care about them more than just for their paycheck. So forgive them for a little artistic license, eh?

3.) The game isn't memorable and lacks substance
Maybe for you. I've thought over a lot of the game's elements, both story-wise and in terms of creature design. What you must understand is that the game does take a more modern approach to horror and is, of course, an American game. Therefore it's based on American horror. You'll see clear references to the Human Centipede, Hostel, and others. However, there are deeper bits of symbolism that you can only really get to when you look closer and think harder. Take Schisms, for example. Yes, they're split-headed, yes, they're a pendulum with legs, yes, they have one arm facing backwards. But they're also so pale, as though they never get any sunlight. Back in the days before mental illness was fully understood, if you had a child with a mental disability, you locked them away in your house. You didn't speak of them, you didn't speak to them, and as far as your relationship with them, you basically treated them the way Adam treated Alex. Schisms are heavily symbolic of Alex. Try looking into the other monsters more and you might find some interesting bits to take into consideration.

4.) The atmosphere and vibes are completely different
It's a different game made by different people with its own goals in mind and it's trying new things. One thing that strikes me more about this game than anything is the color casting of the settings. The fog world is blue while the Otherworld is bright and red. As we all know, the fog world in the original game was because of technology constraints being used for the story's advantage. Ever since that, the series has taken it and run with it through every game but two. (not sure why the falling ash didn't make it the same way, but I guess that's what Shattered Memories is for) In Homecoming, the fog world is dark, though, and not the bright white of the other games. In Homecoming, though, the fog world is symbolizing something rather different. Previously, it was just a realm of uncertainty where you felt somewhat safe, but you still had to keep your guard up. In Homecoming, the fog world is a sign that darker things are coming and that the town is becoming damned. Hence it's a bit darker than before. The Otherworld is red and much brighter than before because that's sort of where things are actually much clearer. It's easier to understand what's going on in the Otherworld of Homecoming. That's where the bosses are and that's where the revelations take place. But enough about that. I agree that the industrial wasteland theme is prevalent instead of a more toned-down world based on the real world, but then again so is the coal mine idea. As for the monsters, well, yes, they're more combat oriented and so are the game's controls. You're looking over the shoulder and, for the most part, you're pretty sure that Alex was in the military.

Conclusion
In short, it's a side story that took many different approaches from the other games. It did its own thing, even if its own thing didn't always quite work out (like Holloway's supervillain speech) With this in mind, no matter how much you say it isn't like the other games, it really doesn't matter. If people keep expecting nothing but Japanese games out of outside developers, they'll be rather disappointed. Come on, guys, we're getting a game from Europe next! Can't use that argument every time.
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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by captain crowbar on Fri Mar 09, 2012 4:23 pm

what wrote:What, precisely, did Mr. Blaustein have to say on the matter? I am not familiar with his thoughts regarding this.

What I realize is that your take on things is ridiculously complicated because you have to account for how completely unrealistic events can take place for a person who is physically still in reality (an accounting which you neglected to make, by the way). Placing the games inside of a different dimension removes that issue, because once you step out of objective reality you almost never have to content with its limits. You have the freedom to break all the rules.

In almost all instances, the best theory is the simplest. That's why Multiple Dimension Theory is the most commonly accepted. This "reality itself is overwritten for people in absurdly selective and arbitrary ways" theory should have been discarded after about three minutes. It is an illogical mess, and it persists as the favorite theory of second-rate theorists who confuse complexity with depth.


Jeremy talking about how his word is bond regarding Silent Hill canon. The words below it aren't important to the point, other than by clarifying that the otherworld is a form of dream world / unreality and not another universe that's sitting around doing nothing until somebody shows up. This is fairly important to remember, since that's what most people think Silent Hill is.

http://s1245.photobucket.com/albums/gg5 ... 716_ng.jpg

Note the red outlined text in the next image. He's saying that what's going on is quite a bit more complicated than "there is Earth and there is Silent Hill universes 1-50". Note that he's actually saying a lot of things that I have been saying all along or that corroborates my theories regarding "it's a lot of sensory mindfuckage that is meant to make you question what is really going on the entire time, and it's not fair to the game to assume that it's so incredibly simple as walking through a door into another world."

Now note the yellow outline.
Jeremy Blaustein said that Fog World was the real world and the Otherworld was an alternate reality where a person's inner thoughts are brought into a state of reality relevant to them. It's another dimension, but really that's not the best word to describe it. He also notes that it was even more complicated in SH4, which is true any way you look at it.

http://s1245.photobucket.com/albums/gg5 ... eBvh-1.jpg

Now this last image is him agreeing that my theory from my videos is very much like his own, and he likes the way I think. Basically, the real world is being overlaid (reality sandwich) by a person's inner world, creating a new world from that twisted combination, and that everyone's senses are fooled into seeing completely different things while present in this twisted world (as proven by Silent Hill 2 a dozen times over, and perhaps in 3: "they look like monsters to you"?).

Also I drew a picture of a purple turtle because I have mild schizophrenia and I also like turtles. Oh, and note the starred portion. We need to stop asking these people about this crap, and I promised not to personally bother anyone anymore with these discussions.

http://s1245.photobucket.com/albums/gg5 ... pFIXED.png

So, point...it's not "too complicated to be true". We're talking about Silent Hill here...even the creators think it's too complicated to be described easily. Also note that I have long since stopped thinking that it's all happening in the "real world", at least not in the way you think. I think it's all on one plane of reality but that it gets manipulated by an infinitely powerful force that warps reality into alternate realities.

So, are you going to argue canon with one of the core sources of canon?
"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. [laughs] Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched c-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhäuser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like [coughs] tears in rain. Time to die."
 
 
 
 
 

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Why I Believe Silent Hill: Homecoming Should Stand Alone

Post by what on Fri Mar 09, 2012 4:41 pm

I think it's all on one plane of reality but that it gets manipulated by an infinitely powerful force that warps reality into alternate realities.


So, in essence, you go along with all the fundamentals of the Multiple Dimension theory but, for whatever reason, insist on using different and more complicated terms to explain it. Which means you're arguing for what reason? What is the practical difference between an alternate reality and an alternate dimension, in the terms of this debate?
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