Is Mary's Body in the back of James car?(Spoilers)

[letsboogey]

This is one theory that I have heard and developed an interested in the theory. I don't the exact detail so please correct me.
It's theory that James arrived to Silent Hill hours before killing Mary and putting her body in the trunk of his car.
Then I came across this.
http://silenthill.wikia.com/wiki/Silent_Hill_2#In_other_media
As I was reading the connection with Silent Hill 2 and Silent Hill 4.
I actually Kind of Believed. But not totally.

Are we talking about downpour?

[what]

But if the body is in the trunk and he obtained it that way its also not supernatural. I am going with this scenario more because its a much simpler one.

If the real body is brought back to life, then we're only left with a supernatural explanation.

Which was not suggested as me since the Rebirth ending doesn't state whether she was ressurected or not. That isn't the issue nor is my opinion of it the issue. The issue was whether or not the body was in the trunk, in which case I think it was.

I agree that the body is in the trunk, it's as good as fact, so far as I can tell. I'm merely theorizing that it isn't used in the ceremony.

[octopuserectus]

Masahiro Ito says that she is, actually, it the back, not it the trunk.
https://twitter.com/#!/adsk4/status/196960739410460672 and https://twitter.com/#!/adsk4/status/196968172086235137

[Noname6]

I believe she is in the trunk, too.

Look at it this way, James killed her and becomes so overcome with grief and guilt that he immediately takes her body and puts her in the back trunk of his car. He then goes through an entire process of denial, but ultimately concocts the story about the letter and Silent Hill, which is calling him. There is simply no other place where he could have dumped Mary's body. Which is another thing, how does James explain what happens to Mary if he leaves the town with Laura? It's easy to blame her death on her ailments, but if there was an autopsy or even an examination of the body it is going to point to the fact that Mary has been murdered. Of course, he could bury her in the Silent Hill cemetary, but then he still has to explain the disappearance of his wife. I am definitely not pointing to one ending or another as being the true one, but I have always wondered how James would resume a normal life after all of this.

[NarooN]

Masahiro Ito says that she is, actually, it the back, not it the trunk.
https://twitter.com/#!/adsk4/status/196960739410460672 and https://twitter.com/#!/adsk4/status/196968172086235137

Thanks for the links. Made some screencaps as fire to use against future naysayers.

[schlaufuchsMIKE]

Isn't the ritual just a facade created by Samael's cultists that would put Samael into the vessel that's being supposedly being resurrected (which in this case would be Mary)?

[Purramid_Head]

Isn't the ritual just a facade created by Samael's cultists that would put Samael into the vessel that's being supposedly being resurrected (which in this case would be Mary)?

You're serious? The cult doesn't worship Samael.

[what]

I believe she is in the trunk, too.

Look at it this way, James killed her and becomes so overcome with grief and guilt that he immediately takes her body and puts her in the back trunk of his car. He then goes through an entire process of denial, but ultimately concocts the story about the letter and Silent Hill, which is calling him. There is simply no other place where he could have dumped Mary's body. Which is another thing, how does James explain what happens to Mary if he leaves the town with Laura? It's easy to blame her death on her ailments, but if there was an autopsy or even an examination of the body it is going to point to the fact that Mary has been murdered. Of course, he could bury her in the Silent Hill cemetary, but then he still has to explain the disappearance of his wife. I am definitely not pointing to one ending or another as being the true one, but I have always wondered how James would resume a normal life after all of this.

He would not resume a normal life. To do so would be practically impossible. He could never possibly cover up what really happened to Mary, nor get away with the lie that it was a natural death. The chance of him ever being able to adopt Laura legally are pretty close to zero, and low even if Mary had died naturally. He would be forced to make a new life under a new identity. That's how the Leave ending still fits with the knowledge that his father knows only that James and Mary disappeared.

[captain crowbar]

I think Silent Hill actually used Mary's body as biological components for Mary/Maria. James brought it there, the town took it and manifested exact replica(s) instead of just twisted abominations (at first). Could explain some things, maybe.

[what]

Why would it need to do that?

[captain crowbar]

Why not? It can do what it wants. I didn't say it needed to do that, just that maybe it could have.

Note: Ghosts and reincarnated physical human beings have happened more than once in this series. Maybe instead of physical manifestations, it's actually reincarnations in a literal sense. Mary's dead body being converted into Maria could be the equivalent to Walter being converted into a unkillable dick.

[Augophthalmoses]

Possible, I guess. But if the town really can do what it wants, then it's also entirely feasible for Maria to manifest without needing additional help from Mary's own body. It's a town that manifests monsters out of nowhere based on a person's psyche. I wouldn't think a body would be necessary to trigger Maria's appearance.

[schlaufuchsMIKE]

Isn't the ritual just a facade created by Samael's cultists that would put Samael into the vessel that's being supposedly being resurrected (which in this case would be Mary)?

You're serious? The cult doesn't worship Samael.

What? They don't?

[Floodclaw]

They worship God. 'Samael' is just a demon that Dahlia deluded herself into believing was God, I think.

[Purramid_Head]

Let me clear this up. The Jewish idea of Satan isn't the anti-thesis of God. He works for God.

Samael is Satan in Kabbalah of Job. But he is not a demon nor is he an incubus. He actually isn't against God at all. He is against people.

The God of the Order is a Native American deity. Only unbelievers call God demon names. By logic, God cannot be Samael if it's root is Native American.

[schlaufuchsMIKE]

Thanks, Xuchilbara. Actually, I had no idea that Samael came from real-world lore. I thought it was a made-up creation for the game.

In any case, is the god that is being "reborn" in SH1, 3 and 4 this Native American diety or is it Samael?

[Devoured]

I browsed through but didn't fully read all of the posts [I still plan to later] but...I'm rather surprised even now no one has pointed out that it's completely and utterly confirmed through the novel, didn't anyone at all read it?

I'll spoiler-tag it for those that have never read it [...everyone?] and still want to do so one day and can thanks to Ducky's English Translations where this translation also came from. This is obviously the end, so it's quite a spoiler if you do still plan to read it :

REVEAL SPOILER

“Mary, I’m back.” James smiled. He had left the hotel and backtracked all the way to the parking lot by the highway where she was waiting. She had always been here, waiting for him.

“Sorry, it’s probably pretty cramped in there…” He opened the trunk of his parked car. He lifted Mary’s curled up body and set her in the passenger’s seat. As he climbed into the driver’s seat, he spoke to her. She was silent, resting inside a sleep from which she would never awaken.

“Mary, I remember everything now. The real reason I came to this town. I wonder what I was so afraid of? As if there were anything in this world that could be scarier than losing you…” He started the engine and stepped on the accelerator.

“Now we can finally be together…just the two of us…” Staring blankly ahead at the mist-enshrouded lake, James kept his foot pressed down on the gas pedal. The smile never left his face.

So...there you have it all.

Mary's dead.
In the trunk.
James goes to SH to kill himself.
The end.

Must've been one heck of a trip back home getting the Leave ending...



Anyway, some random thoughts as to why these things makes sense even without the confirmation :

Just for the sake of argument IMO James was already bordering on being psychotic when he killed Mary, he wouldn't have done it otherwise. There was no sense in it as she already went home to die, to put it bluntly. It's much more likely that being confronted with her and that notion, after not having dealt with her for some time [and even then being able to go away at the end of the day], James 'simply decided' that thing in the bed couldn't be her because for all intents and purposes the Mary he married did die shortly after their trip to Silent Hill. So he kills 'it' and without a doubt very shortly after this, realizing what he's actually done, he goes to Silent Hill to keep his one promise : taking Mary to Silent Hill again, and in order to actually 'be together' with her he's going to have to kill himself as well.

Angela & Eddie likely had similar scenarios - going there to end their lives, but being distracted by Silent Hill's shenenigans in doing so. We know for a fact that Angela is visiting a grave and we later witness her 'killing her father again'. Eddie most likely also 'met' his victim again [when we meet him in the prison]. According to the Book Of Lost Memories, Eddie was supposed to be a very cheerful guy at first, like a counterpart to Angela, probably to more obviously show the contrast of James' dilemma [the whole life / death - Eros / Thanatos thing], whereas in the final version he's a little more grim and obviously also suicidal to begin with, albeit not as obvious as Angela [he very deliberately calls his death upon himself]. To put it simply, Eddie basically achieved the In Water ending [fights his way through the town but ends up being defeated anyway], and Angela got the Maria ending [doesn't die or kill herself in any literal sense but chooses to abandon the 'real' world and embrace the delusions of Silent Hill]. We however have the option to get the Leave ending, in which his will to live does prevail.

In all likelihood James lived in Ashfield and it's not that far from Silent Hill, there's no reason whatsoever he couldn't bring a dead body, especially a fresh one, to a nearby town in the back of his car, especially in the trunk. You people have seen the SH movie too many times. Cops, especially [there's that word again ] small-town cops don't usually assume that everyone driving a car is likely to be a murderer or kidnapper.

@what Just to be anal - I'm no expert but one little thing I wanted to point out is that I'm pretty sure a large part of the decay of the human body takes place 'from the inside', these micro-organisms mostly responsible for it are always there but can't attack us so to speak while our bodies are functioning properly. Once our brain and organs etc have ceased to work they are free to go berserk on us, so as long as she wasn't crawling with maggots I'm not sure if Mary's skin condition would actually be of that much relevance to her state of decay.

Damn, long post...!

[Purramid_Head]

Thanks, Xuchilbara. Actually, I had no idea that Samael came from real-world lore. I thought it was a made-up creation for the game.

In any case, is the god that is being "reborn" in SH1, 3 and 4 this Native American diety or is it Samael?

Me opinion is it is niether. I think it is a demon mistaken for God, but I also think that their rituals are skewed. If you notice the myths say man + woman make god. The man is absent in 3 and the woman in 4.

[Q. Valintyne]

@Devoured:
Your long post is moot to a lot of people since it is the novelization. Lots of people don't see the "In Water" ending as canon, but that doesn't change the fact that she's in the vehicle in some capacity. Even still this is all Sadamu Yamashita's interpretation of SH2 events... albeit it a nice read, it still doesn't hold up to the game.

And since some of us can't read fluent Japanese, who's to say that the translation isn't skewed or embellished?

I think SH4 confirms the fact that James lived in Ashfield at some point. It'd be great if James lived in the same complex that Henry later inhabited. Especially if he lived in Room 208.

[Devoured]

It's pretty clear a great deal of detail and direction was given for the novel, to my knowledge there's nothing anywhere that would contradict it being canon and Ito clearly wasn't 100% sure. It's evident they did decide on something, so even if they for obvious reasons just had to pick one of the endings for the novel, he still crammed her body in the trunk, regardless of the ending we get in the game...

Well I actually meant the town, in his adult life...I don't think it's completely confirmed anywhere that he lived in South Ashfield Heights but James is about 5 years older than Walter and Frank has always been the caretaker, so it's heavily implied. But as far as that goes, 4 also pretty much confirms In Water is canon, Frank says his son and daughter-in-law went missing in Silent Hill.